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GM urges patience as Silverado falls to No. 3

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7 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

 

Tried to buy a Ford-but multiple Ford Dealers (at the time) decided their truck was $5,000.00 better than the Silverado. I disagreed.

Seeing as how Silverado keeps slipping, there are fewer and fewer people that agree with you on this point.

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14 hours ago, J-150 said:

Seeing as how Silverado keeps slipping, there are fewer and fewer people that agree with you on this point.

Check the 2018 sales year.  It's the 2019s that are not moving.

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13 hours ago, akirby said:

More like Chevy decided they couldn't compete with Ford head to head without a $5K price advantage.  And even then they're still losing.

Yes, but the numbers show many sales are going to RAM. Sorry- they are not all buying Fords as their next choice.

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1 hour ago, CKNSLS said:

Yes, but the numbers show many sales are going to RAM. Sorry- they are not all buying Fords as their next choice.

No but Ford sales are still increasing and they’re increasing with several thousand dollars higher ATPs to boot.  Ram and Chevy both need significantly lower pricing to compete with F series.

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I work for one of the biggest public utility fleets on the West Coast.  We have not bought any GM full size pickups/chassis-cabs since early 2018 when they stopped building regular cabs due to the model changeover (a lot of regular cab tooling went to Navistar for the Chevy and International medium duty trucks).  Though the number of truck we buy per year does vary, we often buy several hundred trucks at a time.  So, I do believe that Chevy's numbers are depressed due to certain models being unavailable.  As for Ram, their dealers are blowing out the 'old' Rams with so much money on the hood it's hard to say no.  Not a half bad truck either, considering it's age.  In any event, I think it's a safe bet that Ram will not be able to keep up their current sales pace and GM will start to improve towards the end of this year.    

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2 hours ago, 7Mary3 said:

I work for one of the biggest public utility fleets on the West Coast.  We have not bought any GM full size pickups/chassis-cabs since early 2018 when they stopped building regular cabs due to the model changeover (a lot of regular cab tooling went to Navistar for the Chevy and International medium duty trucks).  Though the number of truck we buy per year does vary, we often buy several hundred trucks at a time.  So, I do believe that Chevy's numbers are depressed due to certain models being unavailable.  As for Ram, their dealers are blowing out the 'old' Rams with so much money on the hood it's hard to say no.  Not a half bad truck either, considering it's age.  In any event, I think it's a safe bet that Ram will not be able to keep up their current sales pace and GM will start to improve towards the end of this year.    

Ram doing just fine.... some issues on 8 speed auto reported but its kinda expected on initial release (ford has there issues as well)...53:1 crawl ratio is nice with 8 speed but i would still opt for a leftover 2018 w/6sp auto...but guys are luvin the 8sp who have em........what the real gripe is lately is dial type auto trans coming in 2020....i am kinda anxious to see what they put on theTRX though...may end up cutting into craptor sales..... i have not seen as ugly a chebby truck since the mid 80's...chebby needs truck guys (and gals) and its obvious some worthless committee was involved in that truck design

Big change for ram is all new eco diesel....should be a significant upgrade for towing which previous small diesel lacked

Edited by snooter

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As many times as I see them, like here behind the drive thru last night, I just cannot accept that this front clip made it out of the studio.

I'd guess that the interior is turning off more sales than the exterior, but holy smokes these things break so many objective categories of sound design.

20190712_200625.jpg

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4 hours ago, snooter said:

Ram doing just fine.... some issues on 8 speed auto reported but its kinda expected on initial release (ford has there issues as well)...53:1 crawl ratio is nice with 8 speed but i would still opt for a leftover 2018 w/6sp auto...but guys are luvin the 8sp who have em........what the real gripe is lately is dial type auto trans coming in 2020....i am kinda anxious to see what they put on theTRX though...may end up cutting into craptor sales..... i have not seen as ugly a chebby truck since the mid 80's...chebby needs truck guys (and gals) and its obvious some worthless committee was involved in that truck design

Big change for ram is all new eco diesel....should be a significant upgrade for towing which previous small diesel lacked

My brothers 2016 Ram has and 8 speed.  And a dial shifter.

The 2019 Ram 2500 with a 6.4 has an 8 speed and a dial shifter.

Good luck finding your new 2018 6 speed, Ebay motors says "zero results".

Edited by MY93SHO

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On 7/13/2019 at 5:05 AM, PREMiERdrum said:

As many times as I see them, like here behind the drive thru last night, I just cannot accept that this front clip made it out of the studio.

I'd guess that the interior is turning off more sales than the exterior, but holy smokes these things break so many objective categories of sound design.

20190712_200625.jpg

Why is that Hyundai can incorporate an "air flow vent" (or what ever the proper terms is) in my wife's car but GM makes it ugly???

20190418_153530.jpg

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2 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

Why is that Hyundai can incorporate an "air flow vent" (or what ever the proper terms is) in my wife's car but GM makes it ugly???

20190418_153530.jpg

Making a boring car is easy, but making something that ugly means they're trying too hard.

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On 7/12/2019 at 10:06 PM, CKNSLS said:

Yes, but the numbers show many sales are going to RAM. Sorry- they are not all buying Fords as their next choice.

To add to what Akirby said, many are waiting for 2 things.

1) The 2020 redesign with the 3rd gen 6.7.

2) The 2020 with the all new 7.3 gas.

The fact that sales are still climbing, higher transaction with less on the hood and so many holding out for August order banks to open..  well ya, enough said.

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GM has a larger % of share in driveway pickups than Ford / RAM. Those buyers are less loyal than Trade/Worker/Fleet buyers. Driveway owners are more likely to jump over to another brand for a better price/value or if they have had an issue with their current truck. 

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35 minutes ago, jasonj80 said:

GM has a larger % of share in driveway pickups than Ford / RAM. Those buyers are less loyal than Trade/Worker/Fleet buyers. Driveway owners are more likely to jump over to another brand for a better price/value or if they have had an issue with their current truck. 

What is a driveway owner?

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1 minute ago, akirby said:

What is a driveway owner?

Someone that does not use their truck for work. Think commuter/lifestyle truck owner, own a truck for camping once a year and the occasional Lowes run.

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12 minutes ago, akirby said:

What is a driveway owner?

 

8 minutes ago, jasonj80 said:

Someone that does not use their truck for work. Think commuter/lifestyle truck owner, own a truck for camping once a year and the occasional Lowes run.

Driveway owners represent the majority of LD pickup truck customers in the U.S.

jasonj80 is correct, Silverado sales are more focused on LD versions and on retail consumers than F-Series or Ram. I think Silverado is still #1 in retail sales of light duty pickups in the first half of 2019, even though the nameplate overall (Silverado LD + HD) is #3 behind F-Series and Ram.

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1 hour ago, jasonj80 said:

GM has a larger % of share in driveway pickups than Ford / RAM. Those buyers are less loyal than Trade/Worker/Fleet buyers. Driveway owners are more likely to jump over to another brand for a better price/value or if they have had an issue with their current truck. 

What’s your source? That seems like a pretty easily made up claim. 

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1 hour ago, jasonj80 said:

GM has a larger % of share in driveway pickups than Ford / RAM. Those buyers are less loyal than Trade/Worker/Fleet buyers. Driveway owners are more likely to jump over to another brand for a better price/value or if they have had an issue with their current truck. 

I can assure you, as a "driveway owner" of a Ford truck, that nothing but a Ford truck will ever be in my driveway. 

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11 minutes ago, twintornados said:

I can assure you, as a "driveway owner" of a Ford truck, that nothing but a Ford truck will ever be in my driveway. 

Ditto!

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31 minutes ago, twintornados said:

I can assure you, as a "driveway owner" of a Ford truck, that nothing but a Ford truck will ever be in my driveway. 

Another ditto!

Am I considered a 'driveway owner' if I use mine for "play" work.  I mean, I would think towing a 13k lb fifth wheel qualifies as work for my truck.  Even though it doesn't even break a sweat.

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40 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

What’s your source? That seems like a pretty easily made up claim. 

Private marketing metrics,  Toyota has the highest % of sales of "Lifestyle" buyers,  but GM leads in total sales. 

Once you data mine the metrics out you get a really good idea of the buyer and can even predict how many will leave and where they will go and even why.  A company will create names and design a product around that person; this target consumer is even getting into the news media world were a network will create a person and tailor the news to that particular demographic. If you look at new trucks you can get a good picture of which buyer demographic they are targeting with their respective pickups. 

 

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Regarding pickup truck owner loyalty, Edmunds said it reached an all time high in 2016. Their data found a category loyalty rate of 74% (pickup truck trade-ins going toward the purchase of another truck). Brands with the highest loyalty in the Edmunds study were Toyota (70%), Chevrolet (69.5%), and Ram (68.1%). https://www.edmunds.com/about/press/truck-loyalty-climbs-to-an-all-time-high-reports-edmundscom.html

But another company, CarGurus, said in 2019 that pickup truck brand and category loyalty is now beginning to decrease. https://investors.cargurus.com/news-releases/news-release-details/cargurus-survey-finds-brand-and-category-loyalty-decreasing

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50 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

Regarding pickup truck owner loyalty, Edmunds said it reached an all time high in 2016. Their data found a category loyalty rate of 74% (pickup truck trade-ins going toward the purchase of another truck). Brands with the highest loyalty in the Edmunds study were Toyota (70%), Chevrolet (69.5%), and Ram (68.1%). https://www.edmunds.com/about/press/truck-loyalty-climbs-to-an-all-time-high-reports-edmundscom.html

But another company, CarGurus, said in 2019 that pickup truck brand and category loyalty is now beginning to decrease. https://investors.cargurus.com/news-releases/news-release-details/cargurus-survey-finds-brand-and-category-loyalty-decreasing

Edmunds was done in 2016 and driven high by Tacoma loyalty according to the article. In 2016 where were buyers going to go in the mid-sized market? What is their sample size for their study. How was the questions asked.

Car Gurus surveyed 1067 Current/Former owners. That isn't a large enough sample size to have valid results based the market size.

 These get Media attention and generate clicks but in statistics they are all but worthless data sets. 

 

Edited by jasonj80

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34 minutes ago, jasonj80 said:

Edmunds was done in 2016 and driven high by Tacoma loyalty according to the article. In 2016 where were buyers going to go in the mid-sized market? What is their sample size for their study. How was the questions asked.

Car Gurus surveyed 1067 Current/Former owners. That isn't a large enough sample size to have valid results based the market size.

 These get Media attention and generate clicks but in statistics they are all but worthless data sets. 

 

Are you trying to tell me 1,067 people do not appropriate represent the 320+ million people in the USA?

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