Bob Rosadini Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 8 hours ago, snooter said: Bob i respect all your insights in regards to what is reality on dealer lots and dealer frustrations...but i would never push these small trucks for there towing ability....they will pull a small trailer with mulch but load them up with a couple dirtbikes and gear and it is quickly becomes apparent a limit has been reached...the taco is just as bad as is anything relative size related (think 4 runner)....yes the f150 and tundra are impressive with towing...but hitch up a tow hauler and u realize you are in need of f250 or larger..summary, i would not purchase the ranger or taco for towing ability..gear and dirt bike they do fine....add trailer and more gear and bikes and its a white knuckle trip to the trail for either truck..... Snooter. trust me I understand what you are saying (I own a class 8 truck) But unless the 7500 lb figure is another bogus number, it is impressive and I would hope that Ford has done enough testing to justify that figure in real world applications. And obviously , everything in that drive train including suspension, brakes as well as engine, transmission has to be up to the task. Now real world, if given the choice, would I rather tow 7500 with an f-250? For sure but Ford is making the claim and I would hope they have the testing info to support that number. And for sure, if it was a matter of day in day out use at that rating, not a good choice-unless you have a big maintenance budget? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 (edited) The irony here is that if you're looking to tow near 7,000 lbs regularly and also want payload as well as extra passengers then maybe a Supercab F150 with 2.7 EB is a better buy than the Ranger. and without much of a penalty price wise and fuel economy. Maybe Ranger brings the F150 Supercab back into focus for more buyers. Edited May 8, 2019 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 On 5/5/2019 at 2:58 PM, HotRunrGuy said: You need to live near a population center. 100+ within 20 miles of me. HRG Total of 131 Rangers in that list 40 are listed as "dealer ordered" Who knows of the remaining are actually in transit. There are 17 dealers in that radius That means at best case there's on average 5 Rangers on each lot. More likely much less because many have not reached dealers yet. So let's play it safe and say there's at least 70 Rangers within 20 miles of that zip. More like around 3-4 Rangers on average on each lot. That's not a lot to choose from in the third largest metro area in the United States. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 1 minute ago, Anthony said: Total of 131 Rangers in that list 40 are listed as "dealer ordered" Who knows of the remaining are actually in transit. There are 17 dealers in that radius That means at best case there's on average 5 Rangers on each lot. More likely much less because many have not reached dealers yet. So let's play it safe and say there's at least 70 Rangers within 20 miles of that zip. More like around 3-4 Rangers on average on each lot. That's not a lot to choose from in the third largest metro area in the United States. I agree. So, what should Ford have done with this product launch? Run production for 6+ months, fill the dealers' back lots with product, THEN launch for sale? Run MAP for 3 shifts 24/7, and make 1000 a day? Then hope the sales happen? Heck, in my local market, I saw my first Gladiator on the streets yesterday. How much later did they start production? HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 30 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: I agree. So, what should Ford have done with this product launch? Run production for 6+ months, fill the dealers' back lots with product, THEN launch for sale? Run MAP for 3 shifts 24/7, and make 1000 a day? Then hope the sales happen? Heck, in my local market, I saw my first Gladiator on the streets yesterday. How much later did they start production? HRG What they are doing is perfectly fine. What the media should do is realize how ramp-up works especially when factories are only running one shift. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 6 hours ago, jpd80 said: The irony here is that if you're looking to tow near 7,000 lbs regularly and also want payload as well as extra passengers then maybe a Supercab F150 with 2.7 EB is a better buy than the Ranger. and without much of a penalty price wise and fuel economy. Maybe Ranger brings the F150 Supercab back into focus for more buyers. Agree- "tow near 7000 lbs regularly" is key phrase. Also what are you towing. A lot of the landscapers around here use box trailers-not open deck trailers. Add more frontal area to the equation and that 7500 lb figure becomes even more marginal. Unless when they state a tow rating they factor that into equation as well as the combined axle loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucelinc Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 I don't know how they are selling in my area but the TV ads for them are shown frequently. There are also bill board ads. The TV spots are excellent, IMO. I see the following ad about every night: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 8, 2019 Author Share Posted May 8, 2019 That could be part of my problem-I haven't watched much in the way of "live" TV lately-mostly streaming services like Netflix or HBOGo I'll be going past a decent sized dealership at lunch today-I'll have to see if they have Rangers in the lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 I'll be honest, if this generation of Ranger is not a hot seller, I'd selfishly love it. I want mine to stay somewhat unique. I love the looks I get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 On 5/7/2019 at 8:05 AM, akirby said: Because they don't have enough inventory built up yet!! It will take a few more months. How many times do we have to explain this? I don't really buy that. Launch media campaign ads are not necessarily to drive sales now. It is supposed to build consumer awareness so it can result in sales later. Ford is launching Ranger in Southern California without any media advertising. It's a bit strange. You launch sales promotions ads later when you have inventory on hand. But you have to prime the pump first so to speak... people are not going to be receptive to sales promotion if they don't know the product exist in the first place. I think one of the issue is TV and outdoor ads in LA media market is very expensive so maybe Ford decided to skip it. I'm not sure if Ford is running launch media campaigns in other regions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 (edited) On 5/6/2019 at 5:05 PM, jpd80 said: So let's look at those other vehicle and their sales last month and YTD trends that Car and Driver are quoting to question Ranger's sales performance... MODEL......APR '19......APR '18...Change.....4MO '19........4 MO '18........4MO CHANGE Ranger............5,748................0.......0.0%..........15,169..................0................0.0% Colorado......11,655........12,345......-5.6%.........45,149..........41,204..............9.6% Canyon...........2,420..........2,960....-18.2%..........9,374...........10,173..............-7.9% Ridgeline........2,654..........2,459.......7.9%..........9,606.............9,464................1.5% Frontier..........4,258..........5,082....-16.2%........24,479............27,907.............-12.3% Tacoma......20,375........18,811.......8.3%.........78,558.............72,590................8.2% Compared to April last year, Colorado off 5.6%, Canyon off 18.2%, Frontier off 16.2%, only Ridgeline and Tacoma growing sales by 7.9% and 8.3% respectivly...all showing that YTD numbers without context is useless. Also, the build up of Ranger's sales is slow exactly because people are coming to terms with Ford's pricing, at the start of April, dealers nation wide had over 10,000 units but i suspect that stocks were clumped into certain regions with differing trim mixes.. Ranger...........US sales.......Canada Sales January...........2,153............201 February..........2,899............173 March.............4,369 ............381 April................5,748.............522 Total............15,169...........1,277 To most people, that would seem more like a slow but steady rise in sales numbers for a truck that let's face it was called up from global duties to fill a roster in North America. Not a perfect fit for the market but certainly does most things well. Also, Jeep is crowing because its dealers are reportedly holding over 25,000 orders for Gladiator. Now for Ranger to continue growing sales against that background and others like GM and Toyota offering good incentives, I think Ford is doing OK shouldering Ranger in past the competition....it is a 2.3 I-4 Ecoboost competing against mostly 3.5-3.6 V6 competition who have an easier sell with the V6. Thanks JPD - This is very helpful in understanding two things: 1. Ranger situation is not as bad as made to sound - but it has a ways to go. Slow and steady...I have high hopes 2. The Tacoma is the the most dominant model in its class on the planet....Wow! More questions to come soon: Will the Gladiator finally be something that can actually take sales from Tacoma? Edited May 8, 2019 by Kev-Mo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailhiker Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 2 hours ago, silvrsvt said: That could be part of my problem-I haven't watched much in the way of "live" TV lately-mostly streaming services like Netflix or HBOGo I'll be going past a decent sized dealership at lunch today-I'll have to see if they have Rangers in the lot. Seems the only TV I watch now is old movies. The only commercials I see are for catheters, stair lifts, night vision sunglasses, supplemental insurance, and "enhancement" pills. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 8, 2019 Author Share Posted May 8, 2019 After my work luncheon, I stopped and got gas next to the big Ford Dealership in Toms River, NJ-a single Ranger XLT on the lot-that was it! Lots of F-150s and Escapes and few EcoSports. Not much in the way of sedan based cars and maybe a half dozen Mustangs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 37 minutes ago, bzcat said: I don't really buy that. Launch media campaign ads are not necessarily to drive sales now. It is supposed to build consumer awareness so it can result in sales later. Ford is launching Ranger in Southern California without any media advertising. It's a bit strange. You launch sales promotions ads later when you have inventory on hand. But you have to prime the pump first so to speak... people are not going to be receptive to sales promotion if they don't know the product exist in the first place. I think one of the issue is TV and outdoor ads in LA media market is very expensive so maybe Ford decided to skip it. I'm not sure if Ford is running launch media campaigns in other regions. I get what you're saying, but not always. Remember back in 2013 when Lincoln did the MKZ ad in the SuperBowl? People ran into Lincoln dealerships the next day to check it out because they liked it, only to find dealers wouldn't be getting any units for months. There's a fine line between too early and not early enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 46 minutes ago, silvrsvt said: After my work luncheon, I stopped and got gas next to the big Ford Dealership in Toms River, NJ-a single Ranger XLT on the lot-that was it! Lots of F-150s and Escapes and few EcoSports. Not much in the way of sedan based cars and maybe a half dozen Mustangs. Downs Ford? They show the (probably) Magnetic you saw, 2 in-transit, and 2 Dealer Ordered. https://www.downsford.com/searchnew.aspx?Model=Ranger#srpRow-1FTER4FH7KLA21560 HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 8, 2019 Author Share Posted May 8, 2019 20 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: Downs Ford? They show the (probably) Magnetic you saw, 2 in-transit, and 2 Dealer Ordered. https://www.downsford.com/searchnew.aspx?Model=Ranger#srpRow-1FTER4FH7KLA21560 HRG Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucelinc Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 20 hours ago, Trailhiker said: Seems the only TV I watch now is old movies. The only commercials I see are for catheters, stair lifts, night vision sunglasses, supplemental insurance, and "enhancement" pills. The only "live" TV I watch is the evening news and NASCAR races. There is a Ranger ad every night on Fox during the news hours. My dealer has 2 in stock and 14 in transit. There are several Ford dealers in the area that may have more.....or not. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailhiker Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, brucelinc said: The only "live" TV I watch is the evening news and NASCAR races. There is a Ranger ad every night on Fox during the news hours. My dealer has 2 in stock and 14 in transit. There are several Ford dealers in the area that may have more.....or not. Glad to see they are letting people know they are out...even if they may need to wait to get the model and color they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 (edited) On 5/9/2019 at 3:22 AM, Kev-Mo said: Thanks JPD - This is very helpful in understanding two things: 1. Ranger situation is not as bad as made to sound - but it has a ways to go. Slow and steady...I have high hopes 2. The Tacoma is the the most dominant model in its class on the planet....Wow! More questions to come soon: Will the Gladiator finally be something that can actually take sales from Tacoma? 1. You see the progression on Ranger sales increase, 2,100 2,900, 4,600, 5,700.....what next, 6,800/7,200? and all against strong selling Tacoma and Colorado 2. Tacoma has built up its own ecosystem of return buyers, a bit like F150 so it's "immune" to the effects of a new player, I'd say that other minor brand sales are taking the hit at the moment as Ranger nudges its way back in.... 3. Jeep is saying that its dealers are holding over 25,000orders for Gladiator, I'd believe that but after that, how much sales depth is not known and whether that come at the cost of Wrangler sales is also not known When you think about it, the '19 Ranger is a place holder that doing a good job of reviving the name and positioning the truck for its much better replacement in a couple of years time, that's when the surge from Bronco and NG ranger will really hit. Edited May 9, 2019 by jpd80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildosvt Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 The supercabs are ramped up big time. Have been for a few weeks. Wonder how that will change the numbers over time as they arrive on lots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 5 minutes ago, wildosvt said: The supercabs are ramped up big time. Have been for a few weeks. Wonder how that will change the numbers over time as they arrive on lots. If it's like other markets, most buyers will take one look and opt for the crew cab, there are some though that appreciate the larger bed even with smaller rear seating. I am surprised that for the US market, they didn't stick the 8 foot single cab bed onto the super cab to make it an easier sell to tradesmen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: I am surprised that for the US market, they didn't stick the 8 foot single cab bed onto the super cab to make it an easier sell to tradesmen. I'm pretty sure their strategy was to hit the heart of the most profitable part of the market first, then make their way to the rest of it. Tradesmen might buy quite a few Rangers, but they're generally going after the low-option, and thus lower-profit, models. I think that's borne out in how hard Ford has made it to get a fleet-optioned Ranger right out of the gate. They don't want to turn away fleet buyers, but they also don't want to be selling a bunch of low-margin variants instead of high-margin retail trucks--they want to sell them in addition to the high-margin variants, but they can't really do that until they can get production rolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, SoonerLS said: I'm pretty sure their strategy was to hit the heart of the most profitable part of the market first, then make their way to the rest of it. Tradesmen might buy quite a few Rangers, but they're generally going after the low-option, and thus lower-profit, models. I think that's borne out in how hard Ford has made it to get a fleet-optioned Ranger right out of the gate. They don't want to turn away fleet buyers, but they also don't want to be selling a bunch of low-margin variants instead of high-margin retail trucks--they want to sell them in addition to the high-margin variants, but they can't really do that until they can get production rolling. Good points. It's a tricky balancing act to get higher margins and for fleets to see the value in buying/leasing better vehicles with better residual value, they are building sales the right way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKX1960 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) On 5/5/2019 at 7:46 AM, MY93SHO said: My dealer finally has "one" sitting on the lot. According to my dealers website, they have 27 of them, in most trims and configurations. IMO, it's a really nice looking truck, but short on a few key features like cooled seats, moonroof, power tilt/teli wheel. They had a black one with black running boards in the showroom. Didn't have many options and stickered for $31 and change. Edited May 10, 2019 by MKX1960 add info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailhiker Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) The Fast Lane Trucks has a youtube video of their off road Ranger vs Gladiator. Edited May 10, 2019 by Trailhiker I wanted to do a link but it embedded it. Hope that is OK. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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