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GordonZoo

Military Rebate on Navigator

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Looking at the Military promotions and my dealer insists the 2019 Navigator is not eligible for a Military Rebate. I read this differently in the QA on the ford web page. Would a Dealer have a monetary interest to keep this from me or would this get paid to me directly from Ford?

 

From Ford web site:

Q) What vehicles are eligible for this promotion?

A) All 2017/2018/2019 Ford and Lincoln Vehicles are eligible for this promotion. This off is not available on the 2018 Lincoln Navigator, Mustang Shelby GT350®, Mustang Shelby® GT350R, Ford GT, Focus RS or F-150 Raptor.

 

 

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Sounds like Navigator isn’t eligible - they just haven’t updated it for 2019 models.

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Maybe look at the Ford X-Plan instead? Just need to join the Mustang Owners Club for $25 for a great deal: https://www.mustang.org/content.php/149-Benefits-of-MCA-Membership Saved me a ton on my '18 Black Label Navigator

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You can usually negotiate the same or better price than X plan on your own since they raised the X plan prices a few years ago. You just have to be careful with added fees and huge documentation fees.

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Really? Has anyone had luck w negotiating lower than X Plan? Maybe bc I'm an out of state buyer, but I had 0 luck. Literally 9/10 dealers I contacted on a specific vehicle ('18 Nav Resv L w bench & tech) wouldn't even honor X Plan. They said they don't discount anything more than $1-2K off sticker, period. Only 1 dealer honored the X Plan so I went w them.

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Really? Has anyone had luck w negotiating lower than X Plan? Maybe bc I'm an out of state buyer, but I had 0 luck. Literally 9/10 dealers I contacted on a specific vehicle ('18 Nav Resv L w bench & tech) wouldn't even honor X Plan. They said they don't discount anything more than $1-2K off sticker, period. Only 1 dealer honored the X Plan so I went w them.

 

It's tougher on a new popular vehicle like the Navi, that's true. Hopefully the 19s have a bit higher supply and more normal demand. However, as you pointed out some dealers wouldn't even accept X plan at all so they were likely selling them close to MSRP.

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The wife and I test drove a Sequoia, Land Cruiser, Lexus 570, Top end Durango, Grand Cherokee, Mercedes GLS and Expy before deciding on the Navi. While at the Lexus dealership we finally come to terms that we liked the Navi best. Up here Herb Chambers mostly has the the market cornered. After looking at the 570 and then deciding that we rather have a Navi they directed up a few miles up the street to their Lincoln dealership. I brought up that I wanted to do an x-plan and he balked at first but then said there shouldn't be a problem as it's the end of the year and he could get management to agree. I picked out one that was perfect that was already ordered on the way and shook hands and said I will bring a cashiers check to hold it. That next day I get a call from one of the managers and she said absolutely no way are they going to do an x-plan. The Dealer was out of line to agree to that and the best they would do is take off $500 from the $89-K sticker. She said they are selling so Hot that the $500 off is a gift for the miscommunication. Apparently they have been going for FULL MSRP. I've never bought MSRP and wont start. I went to a dealer in Brockton which is even closer and they would do x-plan. I put 11-K down and ordered a Reserve with everything but Lincoln Play and Tow. The previous poster is correct in that it is a rarity to get X-plan. Now the Military Discount is treated separate from that. It's a $500 rebate. I've checked Trucar to see what they have been selling for and it's about $2500 off MSRP. X-plan is about $5000 off but I haven't seen better than that.

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^Yep, I was honestly surprised w my experience at the dealer that did end up honoring it. We sat down to talk #s, he's like ok MSRP is blah blah and then I just came out with it "I have X plan, if you can get me plan pricing, let's get it rolling." He said awesome without blinking an eye and we signed that night. Quickest/easiest car purchase ever and I was so thankful to end the search and associated haggling.

 

The way dealers are acting, even on '18s in November, is odd to me especially as their floor plan rates have gone up too. But, they must know what their doing by holding on to minimal discounts of MSRP.

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At one time dealers got a spiff check from Ford on each X plan sale so that made up a lot of the difference. I don't know if that changed but I see a lot of dealers offering X plan pricing or below and not requiring a PIN which would mean they aren't getting a spiff check or they just don't care. This all changed within the last 2-3 years.

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^Yep, I was honestly surprised w my experience at the dealer that did end up honoring it. We sat down to talk #s, he's like ok MSRP is blah blah and then I just came out with it "I have X plan, if you can get me plan pricing, let's get it rolling." He said awesome without blinking an eye and we signed that night. Quickest/easiest car purchase ever and I was so thankful to end the search and associated haggling.

 

The way dealers are acting, even on '18s in November, is odd to me especially as their floor plan rates have gone up too. But, they must know what their doing by holding on to minimal discounts of MSRP.

This is similar to how my experience was, it was awesome! Easily the least stressful quickest car buying experience Ive ever had. Ive been told by some I could have negotiated a better deal blah blah blah..,, Ill happily pay to not deal with the car buying BS. From what Ive seen I got a great deal. The worst part was the wait since we ordered in August of 17.... but it was worth it.

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Any updates on any Navigator deals? We’ve owned BMW, Mercedes, Volvo’s, and never had as much trouble trying to get a decent deal. Dealers seem uninterested in selling one period. I’ve tried working deals on 18’s and they are not a penny cheaper than a 19. I can get the X Plan price but that’s not exactly a good deal on a $90,000 plus vehicle.  We’ve been in BMW’s for the last 9 years and typically get $8000-$9000 off MSRP with good residuals and Money Factor. We really want the Navigator but I’m not paying what they are asking right now and the Money Factor on the 19’s is outrageous, by far the highest I’ve ever seen on a lease for any vehicle. 

We found an 18 we are really interested in but it’s in another city. It has the exact options we want with the color interior we want ( Russett). Both dealerships are owned by the same person. Local sales guy I’ve been working with told me Saturday he’d contact me today regarding this particular Navigator and I never heard a word. This is about the third time he’s done this.  Two dealers have told me they have the one I inquired about, one I saw on their website.  My wife and I drive an hour to see it and they tell me they just sold it an hour or so before we got there, a story I don’t believe, both on weekdays.  

 

 

 

Edited by C130

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They’re selling all the Navis they can make right now and Ford doesn’t have as much room between MSRP and dealer invoice as they used to.  X plan is very close to dealer invoice and probably as good as you’re going to do right now.  

 

Curious what the actual payment difference is on a $90K MSRP Navi vs. a $90K BMW.

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They have plenty of room between MSRP and invoice on ther trucks and Expeditions, Explorers, etc. I have an F450 which is an $80,000 plus truck and got $12;000 off on the same year model, it was not the previous years truck. Same discount as my previous F250. I’ve never used my X Plan and have owned Fords for over 35 years and trade often. I have never bought a vehicle over $70,000 that I didn’t get at least $8000 off MSRP.  The Navigator lease is more than the BMW 750LI we had which was loaded. 

I like the Navigator, it’s what we want, but people are insane paying the same for an 18 as a 19, that’s the part I don’t get. I’ve also had three Navigators I called about and was told they were on the lot. My wife and I drive to the dealership and we were told they had just sold them. I don’t believe it, it’s just a bait and switch tactic. Same thing happened at a Volvo dealership. That’s been a tactic for a while but I’ve never seen it this bad. All three were on a weekday and the exact three we called about.

I can buy an 18 F150 for $15,000-$20,000 off all day, same with the 18 Super Duties. If they are selling the Navigators that well I don’t blame them but I sure don’t see many on the road. It’s the nicest SUV we’ve looked at but I just don’t see many. Escalades, BMW’s, Mercedes, Range Rovers everywhere but not Navigators. 

Edited by C130

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You’re confusing dealer discounts with factory rebates.  My F150 was $10K off MSRP but that included $6K in factory rebates paid by Ford.  The actual dealer discount was only $4K.  Same with your F450.   Those vehicles are not in high demand and short supply like Navi.

I just looked up a Navi with a $91,885 MSRP.  X plan is $87,042 which puts dealer invoice right around $86,250.   And there only appears to be about a $1200 rebate.  

F series sells almost 1M vehicles per year.  Navigator is 15K per year - around 1250 per month.

Whether you like those prices or not, people are paying them so Ford would be stupid to give big discounts.

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I’m not confused, just stating there’s room for them (Lincoln) to mark them down if needed. I guess since they don’t produce very many the suplly isn’t there and the demand is. I don’t blame Ford/Lincoln at all.  I just don’t know why people are buying the leftover 18’s with no incentives when you can buy a 19 for the same price, at least from what I’ve been quoted. Do you think there will be any better incentives this next week when the current ones expire? I was told maybe around the 4th.

Any idea what the average age is buying the Navigator? This isn’t meant as an insult at all but typically Lincoln owners have been much older. I am almost 51 and don’t know a single Lincoln owner anywhere near my age. The Navigator might change that though, hopefully it will. The Aviator looks really nice, I’m betting that’ll be a bigger seller than the Navigator.  

Quote I've been given is $1363 per month, 15,000 miles per year, zero down. MSRP was around $92,000, discounted $5000 for X Pan plus $1100 rebate. I come up with $1100 plus payment, around $1160 I believe, not $1363. I know part of the difference is they marked up the MF. 

Edited by C130

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32 minutes ago, C130 said:

Any idea what the average age is buying the Navigator? This isn’t meant as an insult at all but typically Lincoln owners have been much older. I am almost 51 and don’t know a single Lincoln owner anywhere near my age. The Navigator might change that though, hopefully it will. The Aviator looks really nice, I’m betting that’ll be a bigger seller than the Navigator.  

Will be buying within a year or so and will be 44 years of age. I'm hoping for a "stealth" option from Lincoln like the Ford where you can get black or charcoal rims and some darker accents similar to a Black Pack on Jaguars. If not I will just customize. Also intrigued by the hybrid possibility.

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That would be cool, I like the stealth look. My wife is 6 years younger and had no interest in a Lincoln until we went and drove the Navigator.  I had looked at it a lot online and liked it a lot. Whoever designed the Navigator and Aviator is a genius, very talented.

I don’t have any desire to own a high tech luxury vehicle, had rather lease and be done with it in 3 years. But, current lease rates are not good at all on the Navigator. The 19 has a good residual but the money factor is just outrageous. Maybe it’ll come down when the 18’s inventory comes down. I just have to feel like I’m getting a somewhat reasonable deal and it makes sense financially. So far I don’t see it.  The marked up money factor is a deal breaker considering no incentives. 

Edited by C130

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6 minutes ago, C130 said:

That would be cool, I like the stealth look. My wife is 6 years younger and had no interest in a Lincoln until we went and drove the Navigator.  I had looked at it a lot online and liked it a lot. Whoever designed the Navigator and Aviator is a genius, very talented.

I don’t have any desire to own a high tech luxury vehicle, had rather lease and be done with it in 3 years. But, current lease rates are not good at all on the Navigator. The 19 has a good residual but the money factor is just outrageous. Maybe it’ll come down when the 18’s inventory comes down. I just have to feel like I’m getting a somewhat reasonable deal and it makes sense financially. So far I don’t see it.  The marked up money factor is a deal breaker considering no incentives. 

I too took my wife recently and she was super impressed by the Navigator. She said, "It's nicer than I thought it'd be." It drives much smaller than I'd figured it would. I am trying to get us (me actually) out of a minivan :) I am finding some exchange programs online where you can have the rims black chromed or powder coated in an exchange for under $1000k. My problem is I like the look of the Select rims best but the features of the Reserve. I was thinking Black Label all the way until sitting in the Chalet theme the other day and not liking the interior as much as I'd figured. Now we plan to go White Platinum with Cappuccino interior. We will tint the windows 15% all the way around and put the Black label look to it as far as badging and go with charcoal/black rims and maybe black on some of the chrome trim lines and maybe the grill.

I hear you about leases. With all the tech, leasing makes a bit more sense but also they know that and adjust those MFs and the like to account for it. We trade cars too often and leases make sense generally in that situation, but we plan to keep the Navigator a bit longer this time around (how many times have I said that before?). In the past I have driven too many miles for a lease to make sense. We just leased my wife's Volvo XC60 though and it's our first lease experience--we'll see how it goes.

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Your wife sounds like mine did when we went and drove one. She really likes it and it’s her first choice but she also thinks the current deals are unacceptable. It’s her vehicle, I’m keeping my F450. 

I haven’t ruled out buying it vs. leasing but prefer not to purchase. BMW has had pretty good lease rates and we’ve done three consecutive leases with them.  We really liked our dealership until three years ago. They’ve gone downhill big time in customer service, before they were outstanding. We are looking at the XC90 also. We had Volvo’s for seversl years and they were all great.  I work out of Denver a lot and a dealer there has 18 XC90’s ten thousand off with no negotiating, can’t beat that.  If we don’t get the Navigator I’m pretty sure it’ll be a loaded XC90  

 

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The Navigator allure encompass a pretty wide age group.   We've owned a 97 Expedition, then a 2007 Navigator and now our 2019 is due in next week.  We are now in our mid 50's now but liked the ride of this platform for quite a while for extended road trips.  We test drove a used 2018 for $10-K off the new price but it was at about 24-K miles and found the car-fax had it as a rental.  That was a deal breaker.  The 2018 is no different than the 2019.   In fact it's better in that it costs less because of the price increases.  At the time we agreed to the x-plan on the 2019 we ordered, we were asked if we rather drive home the L they had on the lot for a better deal than an x-plan.   We opted to wait to get the one we wanted instead as we are not in a hurry.  The inventory in the north east over a 100 mile radius has continued to shrink over the last 3 months and is currently at 46.   This inventory reduction may be because of the 2018 to 2019 switch but they are selling faster than they can make them.   I was also told the dealerships are allotted only so many depending on their past history with the factory.     Anyways we signed the papers months ago and I am still happy with x-plan pricing.   I have yet to see any new navigator on the road in Massachusetts.   They are unicorns.     BTW   Happy New Year!

Edited by GordonZoo

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41 minutes ago, C130 said:

Your wife sounds like mine did when we went and drove one. She really likes it and it’s her first choice but she also thinks the current deals are unacceptable. It’s her vehicle, I’m keeping my F450. 

I haven’t ruled out buying it vs. leasing but prefer not to purchase. BMW has had pretty good lease rates and we’ve done three consecutive leases with them.  We really liked our dealership until three years ago. They’ve gone downhill big time in customer service, before they were outstanding. We are looking at the XC90 also. We had Volvo’s for seversl years and they were all great.  I work out of Denver a lot and a dealer there has 18 XC90’s ten thousand off with no negotiating, can’t beat that.  If we don’t get the Navigator I’m pretty sure it’ll be a loaded XC90  

 

BMWs are notorious for pumping up their residuals, correct? I think I read somewhere almost 80% of their new "sales" are leases. They like having all those certified pre-owned BMWs to sell.

Sounds like a pretty great deal on the XC90. We have liked our XC60 so far but have had the service engine light go on about 4 times in 2000 miles. Do love their new exterior AND interior styling. They're supposedly at the bottom of luxury vehicles in terms of reliability right now, but have also heard most of that are reports of problems with the SENSUS and check engine lights and such, not necessarily major issues but annoying nonetheless.

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Yes, typically good residuals on BMW though I don’t have the numbers in front of me. Dealer came off $9000 on our current X5 though when we looked at the new 19 X5 they wanted full MSRP, wouldn’t budge, but they had just gotten them in. They normally start contacting us 6 months prior to lease end to “pull ahead” and get us in a new lease. They do the current lease as a trade in and it saves some sales tax I believe. This time they added our three remaining payments in to the new lease quote which made zero sense. Why would I turn it in if I had to make payments on it. They wanted $400 more per month on a new X5 than our current X5. MSRP was $1100 less on the 19. Sales guy was a young guy and clueless, entire dealership has gone downhill. I keep getting emails from a manager informing me that he knew a certain sales guy had been in touch and asking if we had any questions. It’s always a different sales guy that has supposedly contacted us and we haven’t been contacted by anyone.  

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So if the MSRP was $100K instead of $90K and they gave you a $15K discount instead of a $5K discount, what would you think?

It’s easy for mfrs to raise the MSRP and then put rebates on the hood to make it seem like a better deal.  

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Well, I’m not sure what manufacturer you’re referring to but the X5 has a much lower MSRP than a Navigator Reserve. I think the Navigator should list for more, it’s a much larger vehicle. I also think buying an 18 Navigator for the same price as a 19 doesn’t make financial sense. I’m seeing some 18’s being marked down in n the last few days but not by very much.  The MF on the 19 Navigator is just flat out ridiculous and to me purchasing it is the only way to go right now on a 19. I’m not convinced the resale value will be there though in three or four years. Extended warranty would move a must I think if I bought one. 

I’ve discuss the Navigator with several friends, all who can easily afford one. All agree the current pricing and incentives is ridiculous on 18’s and 19’s. Affording one and being stupid with my money is two different things. If they are selling them I also don’t blame Lincoln at all. There’s still a lot of 18’s available if they are selling so fast though. Some people just have to have a vehicle, those are the ones buying the 18’s at crazy prices. 

Edited by C130

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My point was some people are fixated on how much of a discount they’re getting instead of looking at the actual price compared to the competition.

 

E.g. If 2 vehicles are virtually identical but one has a MSRP of $90K with a $5K discount and the other has a $100K MSRP with a $10K discount, which is the better deal (all else being equal)?  It’s the one that cost $85K, not the one with the biggest “discount”.  MSRP is arbitrary and can be manipulated with factory rebates.

 

I see your point on buying a 18 but a few years ago I did some research on 2 adjacent model years with the same mileage and there isn’t as much difference as you’d think.    In 3 years a 2018 with 45K miles and a 2019 with 45K miles should be very close in value.   Last time I checked on an Explorer it was only $300 or so.   The mileage is the bigger driver.

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