silvrsvt Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 https://insideevs.com/bill-ford-hints-pure-electric-ford-f-150/amp/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Yeah there was an article the other day that (I think) I posted where he mentioned an electric F-150 (don't remember if it was by name). Should be interesting to see what they come up with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Something just hit me in regards to a hybrid F150/Super Duty. It would be awesome for those towing RVs when they can just plug the RV into the truck for a night to have power instead of needing to drag a generator along. Obviously, you won't be running the A/C off of it, but enough power for TV, coffee pot, microwave, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Something just hit me in regards to a hybrid F150/Super Duty. It would be awesome for those towing RVs when they can just plug the RV into the truck for a night to have power instead of needing to drag a generator along. Obviously, you won't be running the A/C off of it, but enough power for TV, coffee pot, microwave, etc. But how do you charge the truck? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 (edited) But how do you charge the truck? With a regular hybrid as fordmantpw mentioned, the battery is self charging when the IC engine is on. Same with PHEV. But a pure electric truck would require easily accessible DC fast charging for the RV situation fordmantpw described. Edited October 2, 2018 by rperez817 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 But how do you charge the truck? On the way to your next destination. I was speaking about hybrid, not BEV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 On the way to your next destination. I was speaking about hybrid, not BEV. Whoops, I missed the word hybrid, and just figured since it was a BEV thread, you were referring to one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 On the way to your next destination. I was speaking about hybrid, not BEV. It won't hold enough of a charge to run more than a few lights - same as the regular battery in a non hybrid. Even a PHEV doesn't recharge the battery while driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Whoops, I missed the word hybrid, and just figured since it was a BEV thread, you were referring to one. Yeah, I went a bit off topic bringing a hybrid into the discussion. It won't hold enough of a charge to run more than a few lights - same as the regular battery in a non hybrid. Huh? You're telling me that a hybrid battery doesn't have more storage than a regular 12V battery? You're crazy dude! Just checked, the Fusion has 1.4kWh of power in the battery. A typical battery is about 1kWh. Weird, I would have expected much more out of a hybrid. So, it would give you about 40% more than a standard 12V battery (though I would expect an F150 to have considerably more energy in the battery). That's more than a few lights, it's likely enough for limited use most of a weekend. I was thinking more of a one-night stopover at a spot with no hookups. It would be perfect for that. Now, the Energi has 7.6kWh, and I was thinking more along these lines. That gives you essentially 7 standard 12V batteries. That's enough for a several nights of off-grid camping. Even a PHEV doesn't recharge the battery while driving. Seriously? That can't be right... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Seriously? That can't be right... Depends on the PHEV mode selection. Ford PHEV like Fusion Energi has 4 modes. Charge sustaining, charge depleting, aggregate, and combustion engine. Charge sustaining & aggregate modes, EV Auto. HV battery is charged automatically while driving. Both HV battery and combusion engine combine in varying proportions for propulsion. Charge depleting mode, EV Now. Majority of power for propulsion drawn from HV battery. When HV battery charge depleted, combusion engine activates automatically. Combustion engine mode, EV Later. Power for propulsion drawn from combustion engine. Conserve all battery power for later use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted October 2, 2018 Author Share Posted October 2, 2018 Id assume the HEV F-150 would have some sort of generator that is slaved off the engine or even maybe a secondary power source like what Mazada is planning on with the rotary engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assimilator Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 I'm not aware of any Hybrid electrification plans for SuperDuty, there might be on onboard generator but that's a very different tech not coupled to the Transmission Hybrid design coming to the F-150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 PHEVs only charge the battery during braking like a regular hybrid and that’s not enough to recharge beyond the normal hybrid mode. The only way to get additional PHEV EV range is by plugging it in. You could charge the PHEV then run it in ICE mode only to conserve the charge but you’re not going to fully charge it just by driving it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 PHEVs only charge the battery during braking like a regular hybrid and that’s not enough to recharge beyond the normal hybrid mode. The only way to get additional PHEV EV range is by plugging it in. You could charge the PHEV then run it in ICE mode only to conserve the charge but you’re not going to fully charge it just by driving it. So you're telling me they don't use the alternator, which is doing essentially nothing if the car battery has a full charge, to top off the hybrid's battery? That just seems like some easy low-hanging fruit to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 So you're telling me they don't use the alternator, which is doing essentially nothing if the car battery has a full charge, to top off the hybrid's battery? That just seems like some easy low-hanging fruit to me. The alternator is driving the accessories AND recharging the battery as needed. It’s never “doing nothing”. The 12V electrical systems in modern vehicles is pretty much maxed out anyway. In my Lincoln LS they couldn’t use electric cooling fans because there wasn’t enough electricity available. As far as I know they only recharge the hybrid/phev battery under braking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 The alternator is driving the accessories AND recharging the battery as needed. Its never doing nothing. The 12V electrical systems in modern vehicles is pretty much maxed out anyway. In my Lincoln LS they couldnt use electric cooling fans because there wasnt enough electricity available. As far as I know they only recharge the hybrid/phev battery under braking. By doing nothing I really meant underutilized. But youve got a point...there are tons of electronics in cars today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 So you're telling me they don't use the alternator, which is doing essentially nothing if the car battery has a full charge, to top off the hybrid's battery? That just seems like some easy low-hanging fruit to me. Ford's hybrid and plug-in hybrid vehicles use 2 AC electric motors. Either one can act as a generator or alternator as well. The two electric motors do away with the need for a traditional alternator and also a traditional transmission. The larger of the 2 motors is used for propulsion (motor mode) and regenerative braking & HV battery charging (generator mode). The smaller one starts the combustion engine (motor mode) and generates electrical power for the larger motor as well as recharges both HV and LV batteries (generator mode). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Ford's hybrid and plug-in hybrid vehicles use 2 AC electric motors. Either one can act as a generator or alternator as well. The two electric motors do away with the need for a traditional alternator and also a traditional transmission. The larger of the 2 motors is used for propulsion (motor mode) and regenerative braking & HV battery charging (generator mode). The smaller one starts the combustion engine (motor mode) and generates electrical power for the larger motor as well as recharges both HV and LV batteries (generator mode). Thank you for that! This is more along the lines of what I was thinking, so now I know Im not way off base. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I don’t think the ICE generates enough electricity to both propel the vehicle and recharge the PHEV battery. Even if it did, that’s not how they’re programmed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I don’t think the ICE generates enough electricity to both propel the vehicle and recharge the PHEV battery. Even if it did, that’s not how they’re programmed. I thought the whole point of the plug in was that it runs off electric and the engine generates electricity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I thought the whole point of the plug in was that it runs off electric and the engine generates electricity? The Volt is the only one I know that does that (I think that's the way it works). In all other hybrids, the engine actually contributes to propulsion and doesn't just generate electricity to charge the batteries. My understanding is what rperez posted. The motor/generator will do some charging while the engine is running, but the engine and electric motors both provide propulsion. The only real difference between HEV and PHEV is that the PHEV has a much larger battery and can be plugged in to charge. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I thought the whole point of the plug in was that it runs off electric and the engine generates electricity? Only Volt as Fordmantpw described and even that doesn't happen at high speeds. The reason is that it's more efficient to drive the vehicle directly than it is to generate electricity and then convert that back to energy at the electric motor. So let's say you could go 35 miles on a gallon of gas using the ICE. If you disconnected the ICE and used it as a generator you'd probably only go 25 or 30 miles. You lose a lot of energy in the conversion. Regenerative braking is truly free energy that would otherwise be wasted as heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailhiker Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I'm trying to imagine an F-150 with Prius hubcaps, blue accents, and a plastic grill cover. Just kidding. It would be very expensive, but I bet lots of fleets would buy them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I'm trying to imagine an F-150 with Prius hubcaps, blue accents, and a plastic grill cover. Just kidding. It would be very expensive, but I bet lots of fleets would buy them. Hybrids aren't always about max mpg. Look at the new Aviator - 3.0LEB hybrid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Hybrids aren't always about max mpg. Look at the new Aviator - 3.0LEB hybrid. The public perception is still the Prius and max MPG. It's going to take a while to change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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