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Lincoln MKT to linger on with no set end date


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Had far higher ATP's than the CV, MGM, TC ever had.

Meh. Maybe on the Lincolns. The Taurus isn't setting ATP records any more than the CV was. And adjusted for inflation, I doubt Flex is doing much better than the MGM was as far as transaction prices go.

 

Was built in the same assembly plant as the Edge/MKX

I'll give you that one

 

didn't need to update the structure on the CV, MGM, TC to meet coming side impact safety changes

That's a BON urban legend. But if it is true, is it really easier to design three whole new vehicles than adding some bracing here and there?

 

allowed them to close an assembly plant saving hundreds of millions and better utilize another

 

Again, I'll give you that

 

allowed a large improvement in CAFE numbers

 

Only because the panthers were still running a 4 spd. Going to the 3.5 and 6 speed would have yielded the same CAFE numbers as anything else. In fact Ford supposedly had a crown vic running around with the 3.5 that did one mpg better than the taurus with the same powertrain.

 

the new retail customers died

That's not true. I personally know at least a dozen people that would be waiting in line to buy a new Town Car. Instead they just keep fixing their old ones. Seriously, no other new car on the market comes close in interior room. The Impala and Taurus are a good 8" narrower in the cabin. The ones that have bought new have largely gone to Suburbans and Escalades. Perhaps Ford can win some back with the new expy and navi.

 

gave already miserable people something more to complain about

That's it. Look down on people because of their choice of vehicle. Edited by Sevensecondsuv
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Can anyone imagine a CV with updated looks and a 2.3EB, 3.3, 2.7EB or 3.5 EB?, missed opportunities....

 

No because it would never meet side impact standards or a host of anything else.

 

The Panther was a crap car-it was far surpassed in refinement and ride by just about anything else on the road.

 

Not everyone wants to drive a couch on the road.

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Panther is not crap. I rode in a brand new Continental yesterday and today and find my 2010 Grand Marquis far more comfortable.

 

But I accept that people don't want cars like Panther anymore. Hopefully I can get 20 years out of my Grand Marquis; otherwise, I will just get a Corolla.

 

Also I would only want a detuned 5.0L if the Panther were still made. No EcoBoost. A more advanced transmission would be fine.

 

Don't care about the IIHS test below.

Edited by ehaase
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The Panther was a crap car-it was far surpassed in refinement and ride by just about anything else on the road.

 

Not everyone wants to drive a couch on the road.

Sheesh! Is your only experience with panthers a few rides in the back seat of beat to **** taxis on their second trip around the 6-digit odometer?

 

The 03+ cars with the new suspension design held their own against any other large sedan of the same years. Try driving an 03+ retail model that's been reasonably well maintained and you'll see what I mean.

Edited by Sevensecondsuv
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Is that video supposed to make me scared of driving a panther? By that logic nobody should be buying or driving small cars at all - doing so puts you at a huge mass disadvantage relative to the average vehicle cruising our roads.

 

It's like the people who spend $800 on the top safety-rated child seat they can find and then put it in the back seat of their Civic. Everything's great until the Suburban pulls out in front of them.

 

Unfortunately nobody pays any attention to the fine print under all those stupid star ratings where it says something to the effect of "these ratings are only meaningful when comparing vehicles within 250 lbs curb weight of each other".

 

That being the case, I'll take my odds in a big heavy panther over many of the "5 star rated" 2800 lb econoboxes that society seems to accept as "safe" based on some contrived nonsense safety rating. Of course, if I was really worried about it, I'd drive my excursion daily. But that's not economical.

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That's a BON urban legend.

No, it's not. I heard it from a Ford engineer on another forum. Another Ford engineer on another forum said that some of the parts for the Panthers were becoming scarce because the suppliers had gone out of business, but I'm not sure if he was being entirely serious about that.

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Is that video supposed to make me scared of driving a panther? By that logic nobody should be buying or driving small cars at all - doing so puts you at a huge mass disadvantage relative to the average vehicle cruising our roads.

 

It's like the people who spend $800 on the top safety-rated child seat they can find and then put it in the back seat of their Civic. Everything's great until the Suburban pulls out in front of them.

 

Unfortunately nobody pays any attention to the fine print under all those stupid star ratings where it says something to the effect of "these ratings are only meaningful when comparing vehicles within 250 lbs curb weight of each other".

 

That being the case, I'll take my odds in a big heavy panther over many of the "5 star rated" 2800 lb econoboxes that society seems to accept as "safe" based on some contrived nonsense safety rating. Of course, if I was really worried about it, I'd drive my excursion daily. But that's not economical.

 

 

I don't know where you've been living but the Crown Victoria is a sedan, smaller and lighter than the utilities and trucks that dominate the road today. The Explorer alone is nearly 1,000 lbs heavier.

 

As for newer small cars vs larger older cars...Science!

 

Edited by Assimilator
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The Explorer alone is nearly 1,000 lbs heavier.

 

As for newer small cars vs larger older cars...Science!

 

https://youtu.be/fPF4fBGNK0U

I don't know what world you've been living in, but per Edmunds.com, 2011 Town Car curb weight is 4345 lbs. 2016 explorer curb weight is 4443 lbs. Just because you want something to be true doesn't mean it is.

 

And nice video of a car from the 1950s before there were any safety features at all. I shouldn't even have to point it out, but panthers obviously had all the same safety stuff as any other car from the first decade of this century. I've seen enough panther vs small cars collisions to know which one my money is on.

 

You people should try something before you bash it.

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I don't know what world you've been living in, but per Edmunds.com, 2011 Town Car curb weight is 4345 lbs. 2016 explorer curb weight is 4443 lbs. Just because you want something to be true doesn't mean it is.

 

And nice video of a car from the 1950s before there were any safety features at all. I shouldn't even have to point it out, but panthers obviously had all the same safety stuff as any other car from the first decade of this century. I've seen enough panther vs small cars collisions to know which one my money is on.

 

You people should try something before you bash it.

and you should accept it's not 1985 and the industry has moved on.
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If Ford came out with a new BOF Town Car the panther mafia would rejoice - then wait until they hit the used market to buy them. Sales would be terrible and it would get cancelled and the panther mafia would complain that Ford doesn't know the market.

 

If there were truly a market then somebody would be building them. Unibody cars can be made to handle and ride very soft but nobody wants that nowadays. Like fuzzy said it's not 1985.

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The grille swap they pulled last year makes this thing a bit better looking in real world situations. If it weren't for the ungainly liftgate treatment (such an easy fix!), this could have fared much better.

 

I was shocked at the deals I was finding on used MKTs when I was shopping for my Flex this spring... there were a few that were tempting.

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If Ford came out with a new BOF Town Car the panther mafia would rejoice - then wait until they hit the used market to buy them. Sales would be terrible and it would get cancelled and the panther mafia would complain that Ford doesn't know the market.

I don't think there's anything magical about BOF. I think a unibody panther replacement would be well received.

 

The attributes of the panther that are so loved by the mafia boil down to primarily four things: 1) huge interior space, 2) huge trunk, 3) smooth V8 feel and exhaust note, 4) rwd layout. BOF vs Unibody is largly irrelevant.

 

I went to the dealer and looked really hard at Taurus, Flex, Edge, and Explorer when we buying a new car back in March in anticipation of kid #3. None of those was wide enough for three car seats in the back seat (Edge was 51", the other three were 53", panther is 61" for comparison). Yes the Flex and Explorer were 3 row, but you lose most of the cargo space if you have the third row folded up. The panther was just too ideal - three car seats fit with ease, it can even take a sixth passenger up front middle in a pinch, and still has a huge trunk. Real world fuel economy is even a little better than an Explorer. So I did the logical thing and bought the cleanest Town Car I could find. At first my wife hated the idea of it, but she's since come around and acknowledges the extreme practically of it and likes how smooth it drives - even if she's not big on the looks.

 

The only thing that I don't like about it is the antiquated 4 spd auto. I'm researching what it would take to install a 6R80. Unfortunately it gets complicated with the electronics.

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Uh no...that market is either dead or living in assisted living. There is ZERO demand for a large sedan.

You know what? We don't really know if such a product would sell because there hasn't been a fresh one in the mainstream market for decades. I'm talking something at least 60" wide inside, 125"+ wheelbase, all the latest tech, and a serious powertrain.

 

The closest we have is the DCX cars which actually sell relatively well despite being old. But I'm taking about something bigger than the the DCX. Basically something the size of the F-150.

 

You're probably right that there's not much market for such a beast. But automotive history is full of wild successes that no one saw coming. Plus you never know which vehicle type is going to experience the "what's old is new again" phenomena. I'm not saying this is something Ford should pursue right now, but it would be interesting to see how the market would respond to such an offering.

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I don't think there's anything magical about BOF. I think a unibody panther replacement would be well received.

 

The attributes of the panther that are so loved by the mafia boil down to primarily four things: 1) huge interior space, 2) huge trunk, 3) smooth V8 feel and exhaust note, 4) rwd layout. BOF vs Unibody is largly irrelevant.

 

I went to the dealer and looked really hard at Taurus, Flex, Edge, and Explorer when we buying a new car back in March in anticipation of kid #3. None of those was wide enough for three car seats in the back seat (Edge was 51", the other three were 53", panther is 61" for comparison). Yes the Flex and Explorer were 3 row, but you lose most of the cargo space if you have the third row folded up. The panther was just too ideal - three car seats fit with ease, it can even take a sixth passenger up front middle in a pinch, and still has a huge trunk. Real world fuel economy is even a little better than an Explorer. So I did the logical thing and bought the cleanest Town Car I could find. At first my wife hated the idea of it, but she's since come around and acknowledges the extreme practically of it and likes how smooth it drives - even if she's not big on the looks.

 

The only thing that I don't like about it is the antiquated 4 spd auto. I'm researching what it would take to install a 6R80. Unfortunately it gets complicated with the electronics.

Closest cousin would be 2008 Ford Explorer, I think it had 4.6 3V and a 6R60

you might get thepower train and ECU /harness to mate .....

 

but you probably already knew that..:)

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