fuzzymoomoo Posted July 10, 2018 Share Posted July 10, 2018 Does this mean that the Explorer will finally get a 3 wide 3rd row seat? I dont know for sure, but I think thats a fair assumption. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted July 10, 2018 Share Posted July 10, 2018 Does this mean that the Explorer will finally get a 3 wide 3rd row seat? Hell, even the 2nd row couldn't fit 3 comfortably. Put a car seat on each side and forget anyone sitting in the middle, especially with the inflatable 2nd row belts. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 CD6 Explorer becomes bigger than Grand Cherokee while Edge and Bronco fills the role below. Obviously smaller than GC but maybe Ford's strategy covers the market better without direct competition. D4 Explorer is 9" longer than Grand Cherokee... so it goes without saying that CD6 Explorer will be bigger than Grand Cherokee too but I don't think CD6 will be significantly larger than D4. Edge is already the same size as Grand Cherokee. If I had to guess, Bronco will be roughly the same size as Edge 5 seat given that Everest is the same size as Edge 7 seat. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 I had Bronco pegged somewhere between Escape and Edge in size Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) I had Bronco pegged somewhere between Escape and Edge in size Maybe the 2 door one. The 4 door one will be at least the same size as the 5 seat Edge. The sweet spot in the market is midsize. Model - WB // L x W x H Wrangler 2 door - 96.8" // 166.8" x 73.9" x 73.6" <<I picture 2 door Bronco fitting in right about here around the same size as Wrangler 2 door or Prado 2 door ~ 170" long>> Prado 2 door - 96.6"// 176.6" x 74.2" x 72.6" Escape - 105.9" // 178.1" x 72.4" x 67" Prado 4 door - 109.8 // 187.4" x 74.2" x 72.6" Edge 5 seat - 112.2 // 188.1" x 75.9" x 68.6" Wrangler 4 door - 118.4" // 188.4" x 73.9" x 73.6" <<I picture 4 door Bronco fitting in right about here around the same size as Wrangler 4 door or 4Runner ~ 189" long>> Grand Cherokee - 114.8" // 189.9" x 76.3" x 69.3" 4Runner - 109.8" // 189.9" x 75.8" x 71.5" Highlander - 109.8" // 191.1" x 75.8" x 68.1" Edge 7 seat - 112.2" // 192" x 75.9" x 68.6" Everest - 112.2" // 192.6" x 73.3" x 72.3" D4 Explorer - 112.6" // 197.1" x 78.9" x 70.4" (I'm guessing CD6 will have WB close to 120" and Length under 200") Durango - 119.9" // 199.8" x 75.8" x 70.9" CX-9 - 115" // 199.9" x 77.5" x 68.8" Traverse - 120.9" // 204.3" x 78.6" x 70.7" Edited July 11, 2018 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 The packaging on Explorer and Aviator is significantly more efficient while exterior dimensions are generally longer, lower, and wider which makes it look smaller than the taller and boxier D4 Explorer. I get the impression that Explorer is more Flex-like than I would personally like but it's not quite that wagon-like even if the interior packaging is somewhat similar. Actually, the new Explorer looks like the current Explorer but flattened and stretched. I think it looks sharp but not all SUV fans will be happy since it's moving further away from that tall utility aesthetic...I think that's why Bronco is timed to arrive at the same time. Ford Crossovers are getting lower and lower to the ground for efficiency. The Edge dropped 2-inches, the Escape will drop an inch I believe. When you see this happening you see why cars are no longer needed, they are starting to merge in the middle. The Explorer is going to be great but I'm not sure it's exactly what consumers are looking for, I'm a little iffy on the mass appeal but it's a technologically powerhouse and Ford's flagship for sure. It should generate tons of excitement and I would certainly buy one before seeing Aviator. Some things to look for, the new 10-Speed Hybrid transmission design which will be mated to at least two engines between Explorer and Aviator (3.3L V6 and 3.0L EB). Optional Larger Vertical/Portrait infotainment screen with a split view for the car's controls and Apple CarPlay/Android Auto. It will be the first Ford with these two technologies but they are rolling out to all their premium RWD products. Ford is suppose to be deploying a HUD in the US but I'm not clear on what vehicles are getting it, I assume Explorer is a likely candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 I hope the engine choices include the 2.3 which to me would be a better choice than the 3.3. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) I hope the engine choices include the 2.3 which to me would be a better choice than the 3.3. I'm sure there will be a 4 cylinder Explorer. 2.3 EB is a pretty good bet. Although if Ford has any desire to sell the car in China and Europe, they really need an updated 2.0 EB that matches the output of 2.3 EB. Edited July 11, 2018 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 It’s definitely time for Ford to upgrade/replace its small 4 cylinder motors - the ng Escape will need them to be competitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 I hope the engine choices include the 2.3 which to me would be a better choice than the 3.3. The 3.3 V6 will be there as a base V6 as well as 3.3 V6 Hybrid, I wonder if 2.7 EB is there instead of the 2.3 EB and of course, the 3.5 Ecoboost. with that line up, it's basically all V6s with the engine bay set up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 I'm sure there will be a 4 cylinder Explorer. 2.3 EB is a pretty good bet. Although if Ford has any desire to sell the car in China and Europe, they really need an updated 2.0 EB that matches the output of 2.3 EB. In those markets, I think that's the job of either the Panther 2.0 Diesel or the 3.3 Hybrid... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 In those markets, I think that's the job of either the Panther 2.0 Diesel or the 3.3 Hybrid... Wouldn't the hybrid still get hit with additional taxes since its over 2.0L in some markets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Hell, even the 2nd row couldn't fit 3 comfortably. Put a car seat on each side and forget anyone sitting in the middle, especially with the inflatable 2nd row belts. Luckily, we haven't had to worry about car seats for quite a while now. We can fit three comfortably in our 2nd row seat, but the seat belts are a bit of a pain to buckle. With my kids getting older, we'll probably end up with an Edge or Escape for my wife's next vehicle (or maybe a Bronco if I can talk her into it ). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Model - WB // L x W x H Wrangler 2 door - 96.8" // 166.8" x 73.9" x 73.6" <<I picture 2 door Bronco fitting in right about here around the same size as Wrangler 2 door or Prado 2 door ~ 170" long>> Prado 2 door - 96.6"// 176.6" x 74.2" x 72.6" Escape - 105.9" // 178.1" x 72.4" x 67" Prado 4 door - 109.8 // 187.4" x 74.2" x 72.6" Edge 5 seat - 112.2 // 188.1" x 75.9" x 68.6" Wrangler 4 door - 118.4" // 188.4" x 73.9" x 73.6" <<I picture 4 door Bronco fitting in right about here around the same size as Wrangler 4 door or 4Runner ~ 189" long>> Grand Cherokee - 114.8" // 189.9" x 76.3" x 69.3" 4Runner - 109.8" // 189.9" x 75.8" x 71.5" I hope so, the only thing I hate about SHO is how fucking big it is-I'll be happy to have a product roughly the length of my Mustang again. The only question is 2 or 4 door Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) In those markets, I think that's the job of either the Panther 2.0 Diesel or the 3.3 Hybrid... Diesel will be effectively banned in all the major markets during the lifecycle of CD6 Explorer so Ford would be foolish to bank on 2.0 diesel doing all the heavy lifting. They need a 2.0 turbo gas engine for China (Ford already confirmed it will build Explorer and Aviator in China). Or perhaps a 2.0 hybrid or PHEV. The 3.3 is a non-starter outside of a handful of markets - e.g. besides North America, Australia, and Middle East where there are no CO2 or annual engine displacement based taxes. 3.3 V6 will put Explorer in the same tax bracket as 4.0 V8 in most places. Ditto 2.3 EB which will be outside of the 2.0 class. Edited July 11, 2018 by bzcat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Diesel will be effectively banned in all the major markets during the lifecycle of CD6 Explorer so Ford would be foolish to bank on 2.0 diesel doing all the heavy lifting. They need a 2.0 turbo gas engine for China (Ford already confirmed it will build Explorer and Aviator in China). Or perhaps a 2.0 hybrid or PHEV. The 3.3 is a non-starter outside of a handful of markets - e.g. besides North America, Australia, and Middle East where there are no CO2 or annual engine displacement based taxes. 3.3 V6 will put Explorer in the same tax bracket as 4.0 V8 in most places. Ditto 2.3 EB which will be outside of the 2.0 class. Bosch has come out with a revolutionary exhaust management system that reduces emissions to around 10% of current mandated limits. A 2.0 Turbo gas engine wont work properly in such a large, heavy vehicle, Ford already showed that by switching from 2.0 EB to 2.3 EB in the Explorer. It would be a little naieve to think that disel is going away just yet thanks to the knee jerk reaction of a few European city centers. Those legislating against diesel were doing so in a vacuum and not understanding what is possible with further emission reductions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) Wouldn't the hybrid still get hit with additional taxes since its over 2.0L in some markets? The biggest concern would be China,I think that changes if local manufacture of Explorer occurs there with Aviator. Edited July 11, 2018 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) Bosch has come out with a revolutionary exhaust management system that reduces emissions to around 10% of current mandated limits. A 2.0 Turbo gas engine wont work properly in such a large, heavy vehicle, Ford already showed that by switching from 2.0 EB to 2.3 EB in the Explorer. It would be a little naieve to think that disel is going away just yet thanks to the knee jerk reaction of a few European city centers. Those legislating against diesel were doing so in a vacuum and not understanding what is possible with further emission reductions. Ford switched to 2.3 EB because their 2.0 EB didn't cut it.Everyone else figured out how to do it with just 2.0 liter. Ford needs a new 2.0 turbo. It will be a major fail of epic proportions if thet are not working on one to debut with CD6 Explorer. They'll need it also for the new Escape and next gen Edge. Diesel will become ever more marginalized in the market. It won't go away completely but if you can only drive your fancy SUV on the weekends on countryside B roads, then what is the point? Diesel SUV registration in Europe are going down... it's 50% lower than before - diesel had account for 70% of SUV sales but this year, it plummeted to 35%. This is not a knee jerk reaction... it is a paradigm shift like the move away from sedan to SUV in the US. The writing is on the wall and once the current model cycle runs its course, these SUVs will all be replaced by gasoline PHEV or pure EV. https://global.handelsblatt.com/companies/diesel-suv-sales-collapsing-study-reveals-931960 In the first 4 months of 2018, the proportion of [diesel] new SUV registrations fell to 35 percent. The annual figure had been static at around 70 percent but last year dropped to 44 percent. Edited July 11, 2018 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Ford switched to 2.3 EB because their 2.0 EB didn't cut it.Everyone else figured out how to do it with just 2.0 liter. Where does Ford use a 2.3L where the competition is using 2.0L? "Everyone else" isn't using a 2.0L in mustangs and explorers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY93SHO Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Where does Ford use a 2.3L where the competition is using 2.0L? "Everyone else" isn't using a 2.0L in mustangs and explorers. Camaro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 Where does Ford use a 2.3L where the competition is using 2.0L? "Everyone else" isn't using a 2.0L in mustangs and explorers. The Traverse & Camaro both have 2.0L Turbo engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) Where does Ford use a 2.3L where the competition is using 2.0L? "Everyone else" isn't using a 2.0L in mustangs and explorers. Audi, BMW, GM, Honda, Mercedes, Jaguar, Hyundai, Land Rover, Lexus, Mazda, Volvo, Toyota, VW all use 2.0 turbo. I think that qualifies as "everyone else". Edited July 11, 2018 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 The Traverse & Camaro both have 2.0L Turbo engines. And we know how well the Camaro is selling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 Audi, BMW, GM, Honda, Mercedes, Jaguar, Hyundai, Land Rover, Lexus, Mazda, Volvo, Toyota, VW all use 2.0 turbo. I think that qualifies as "everyone else". Do they use it on an Explorer competitor or on smaller vehicles? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 The Traverse & Camaro both have 2.0L Turbo engines. I didn’t realize Traverse had it. Even so, how does that prove that GM can “get by” with the 2.0L while Ford is forced to use the 2.3L because the 2.0 isn’t good enough? Do the GM 2.0s perform the same as the Ford 2.3s? Or does Ford provide better performance then their GM counterparts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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