Jump to content

Custom Search





2019 Lincoln Aviator Introduced Here !


Welcome to Blue Oval Forums


Sign In  Log in with Facebook

Create Account
Welcome to Blue Oval Forums.  You must first register to create topics and post replies. Registration is a quick and easy process and only takes a minute.  Be apart of Blue Oval Forums by signing in or creating an account.
  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members
  • Create a photo album and post images
  • Use the Shout feature and more. . .
Click here to create an account now.
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Photo
- - - - -

2019 Corvette vs GT


  • Please log in to reply
25 replies to this topic

#21 OFFLINE   jcartwright99

jcartwright99

    Blue Oval Member

  • Blue Oval Member
  • PipPip
  • 532 posts
  • Joined 29-November 10
  • Region:U.S. Great Lakes
  • Location:Chicago
  • Current Vehicle:2017 Ford Fusion Titanium AWD

Posted 05 February 2018 - 04:09 PM

I had a discussion about the Corvette with a  friend of mine who is employed with GM the other day. He does clay modeling for their performance cars. Yes, they still do that. Anyways, we got on the topic of the Vette and he explained that if Chevy didn't do the outrageous higher end Vettes, not many folks would by them. He called them Halo Vette's. These halo vettes get the mid life crisis guys into the lower level vettes. Their demographic is shrinking big time. That's is one of the reasons they are switching to a mid engine car to get more successful younger buyers, as well as better performance. They can throw a supercharger on these and put race suspensions and giants wings that can hit great numbers on the track. However, they are still a low tech, old man performance car in the eyes of many under the age of 45. This is the last hurrah for the Vette in it's current form. The current iteration will be around for a few (5 at most) more years but the mid engine car is the future of the Corvette. They will be produced in conjunction for a few years, then the front engine will be dropped.

 

In regards to the GT vs the ZR1, we have one hero lap time going against a car magazine lap time which in itself is dumb. Put both cars on a track with two equally skilled racers/drivers on the same day and see who gets the best times. Better yet, make it multiple laps in a row. But hey, GM is getting the mileage out of that lap


2017 Ford Fusion

2017 Lincoln MKZ

2014 Ford Escape

2012 Ford Edge

2001 Lincoln LS

1990 Oldsmobile 88

1993 Honda Civic Si

 








Lose this advertisement by becoming a member. Click here to create a free account.


#22 OFFLINE   meyeste

meyeste

    New BON Member

  • Blue Oval Member
  • Pip
  • 174 posts
  • Joined 13-August 05
  • Location:Maryland

Posted 05 February 2018 - 05:16 PM

 

Ford built the GT because of Le Mans. It was kept in a certain spec for racing purposes. It fulfilled it's obligations because it did win and brought attention to the anniversary. It did this all while being a test bed for Ford Performance and ecoboost technology. All the while selling out of the 250/year that will be built for the road at 500k a pop. However as a Ford fan,  Chevy has been kicking the teeth of Ford for a while in the performance department and the ZR1  just adds to it. They also get more mileage and press out of it too. Within minutes of the press release, this was on the front page of the Detroit News and Free press, as well as Car and Driver.  Maybe if they ever release the GT500 Ford will be able to trounce the guys in the RenCen.

Interesting comment, what do you mean by "kicking the teeth"? In 5 years a GT owner will likely be able to sell his GT at a nice profit, in 5 years the ZR1 owner will undoubtedly take a loss, as will an owner of the the ZL1, Z06, ZL1 1LE, etc - if it has a GM stamp on it it loses value. The GT represents a clear benchmark in automotive development, consider the Z06 which slightly overmatches the GT in HP and definitely has 100 more ft-lb torque yet the GT is considerably faster around a track than the Z06. I really don't see it happening however should someone at Ford want to beat the ZR-1, I doubt they'd have to match the 750 HP rating of the LT5 to do it, my guess is it'd take no more than 700HP in a GT to beat the GT's time, though quite honestly it may well be a driver intent on beating the mark could do it w/o an any added power at all. While I believe Billy Johnson was not actually attempting to set a course record, without a doubt the GM team had one goal in mind when they showed up not even two weeks later.  

As far as Camaro vs. Mustang - go over to gmauthority.com and you'll find "the situation is bleak" in reference to the steady decline of the Camaro since it's redesign. I actually went to buy a Camaro sadily based on the COTY reviews, when I checked the price on a V6 - $38k I kinda decided against, however when I opened the door the decision against it was made, it's just too small I am not young and I know if you're sitting in a car for the first time and thinking "it's not so bad" - with regard to comfort, a year down the road - if that you're going to hate it. On the other hand, the trip to the Ford dear not long after reveal the Mustang was "just right", it looks good, it feels good to sit in, having for a while I find it "fit's like a glove" it's frankly amazing how intuitive the interior design of the S550 actually is. Take the Mustang emblem off the car, I know I'd still buy it. In fact there is but one person near me that bought the 2016 Camaro - they traded it just a tad over 4 months later - because it is so small, bought a Honda CRV instead and actually pocketed some cash. IMO Ford nailed it on the S550 Mustang. Frankly as much as C&D and MT want everyone to believe it's all about road course times - let's get real - drag strip times still rule when it comes to the Mustang and Camaro - and again Ford nailed it on that one. However, where Ford has really turned it on is with the Expedition and Navigator redesign, I don't think GM really cares one way or another about the Camaro vs. Mustang - it's a fun competition, however the new Expedition and Navigator have put fear into their hearts as Ford is going for GM's bread and butter. 


  • fordtech1 likes this

#23 OFFLINE   jcartwright99

jcartwright99

    Blue Oval Member

  • Blue Oval Member
  • PipPip
  • 532 posts
  • Joined 29-November 10
  • Region:U.S. Great Lakes
  • Location:Chicago
  • Current Vehicle:2017 Ford Fusion Titanium AWD

Posted 06 February 2018 - 11:22 AM

Interesting comment, what do you mean by "kicking the teeth"? In 5 years a GT owner will likely be able to sell his GT at a nice profit, in 5 years the ZR1 owner will undoubtedly take a loss, as will an owner of the the ZL1, Z06, ZL1 1LE, etc - if it has a GM stamp on it it loses value. The GT represents a clear benchmark in automotive development, consider the Z06 which slightly overmatches the GT in HP and definitely has 100 more ft-lb torque yet the GT is considerably faster around a track than the Z06. I really don't see it happening however should someone at Ford want to beat the ZR-1, I doubt they'd have to match the 750 HP rating of the LT5 to do it, my guess is it'd take no more than 700HP in a GT to beat the GT's time, though quite honestly it may well be a driver intent on beating the mark could do it w/o an any added power at all. While I believe Billy Johnson was not actually attempting to set a course record, without a doubt the GM team had one goal in mind when they showed up not even two weeks later.  

As far as Camaro vs. Mustang - go over to gmauthority.com and you'll find "the situation is bleak" in reference to the steady decline of the Camaro since it's redesign. I actually went to buy a Camaro sadily based on the COTY reviews, when I checked the price on a V6 - $38k I kinda decided against, however when I opened the door the decision against it was made, it's just too small I am not young and I know if you're sitting in a car for the first time and thinking "it's not so bad" - with regard to comfort, a year down the road - if that you're going to hate it. On the other hand, the trip to the Ford dear not long after reveal the Mustang was "just right", it looks good, it feels good to sit in, having for a while I find it "fit's like a glove" it's frankly amazing how intuitive the interior design of the S550 actually is. Take the Mustang emblem off the car, I know I'd still buy it. In fact there is but one person near me that bought the 2016 Camaro - they traded it just a tad over 4 months later - because it is so small, bought a Honda CRV instead and actually pocketed some cash. IMO Ford nailed it on the S550 Mustang. Frankly as much as C&D and MT want everyone to believe it's all about road course times - let's get real - drag strip times still rule when it comes to the Mustang and Camaro - and again Ford nailed it on that one. However, where Ford has really turned it on is with the Expedition and Navigator redesign, I don't think GM really cares one way or another about the Camaro vs. Mustang - it's a fun competition, however the new Expedition and Navigator have put fear into their hearts as Ford is going for GM's bread and butter. 

 

You're going a bit off topic there. What I was mostly referring to was that in recent years, the Camaro has handed the Mustang it's butt on both the track and the strip. It has, largely thanks to the widely available 1lE packages, been a better bang for the buck in the performance category. The 2015 Mustang redesign while great added weight and the 2016 Camaro went on a serious diet. While the GT350 is a great package, it's cost plus ADM make the SS 1LE a better value. The R is in a different category but for the price, a Corvette MAY be a better value for performance (two different types of cars I know). The GT/ZR1 comparison is strictly a media pissing contest for headlines. The GT is the better car period. 

 

Now history has a habit of repeating itself, if you look at sales. With the exception of a few months here and there, the Mustang has outsold the Camaro. It's been pretty significant too. While Big Al at Chevy loves the performance bragging rights, 95% of the people who own these cars don't track it. Daily driving becomes more of a factor. Will the Camaro survive, probably but the car is shares it's platform with is barely selling as well. I would absolutely laugh if they discontinued the Camaro again.


2017 Ford Fusion

2017 Lincoln MKZ

2014 Ford Escape

2012 Ford Edge

2001 Lincoln LS

1990 Oldsmobile 88

1993 Honda Civic Si

 


#24 OFFLINE   fordmantpw

fordmantpw

    akirby's stunt double

  • Blue Oval Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 10,171 posts
  • Joined 30-January 06
  • Region:U.S. Mississippi Valley
  • Location:Mid Missouri
  • Current Vehicle:2017 F350 Crew Cab 4x4 PowerStroke Diesel

Posted 06 February 2018 - 11:55 AM

 

...the Camaro has handed the Mustang it's butt on both the track and the strip.

 

With the exception of a few months here and there, the Mustang has outsold the Camaro. It's been pretty significant too.

 

Those have both been the case for as long as I can remember.


photo-thumb-15254.jpg

 

Future Vehicles
2020 Ford Explorer/Lincoln Aviator

Current Vehicles
'17 F350 Super Duty Crew Cab, Lariat, 4x4, 6.7L Diesel

'10 Mercury Milan

'09 Ford Flex Limited (wife's)

Past Vehicles
'08 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab, Lariat, 4x4, 6.4L Diesel
'05 Ford F150 XLT SuperCrew 4x4 5.4 - sold @53k, not a single problem
'03 Ford Escape XLT
(wife's) Traded at 75k for '09 Flex
'99 Ford F150 XLT Regular Cab 4x4 5.4 - Sold @136k, then totaled by the new owner on the way to its new home :(
'96 Chevrolet Cavalier (wife's - she brought it into the marriage)
'86 Ford Bronco II XLT 4x4 5 Speed 2.9L - what a dog, and it cracked heads like no tomorrow. 150k+ on 4 engines


#25 OFFLINE   akirby

akirby

    fordmantpw's alter ego

  • Moderator
  • 29,139 posts
  • Joined 18-April 06
  • Region:Decline
  • Location:Canton, GA
  • Current Vehicle:2018 F150 Supercab XLT Magnetic Grey 3.5LEB

Posted 06 February 2018 - 12:10 PM

You're going a bit off topic there. What I was mostly referring to was that in recent years, the Camaro has handed the Mustang it's butt on both the track and the strip. It has, largely thanks to the widely available 1lE packages, been a better bang for the buck in the performance category. The 2015 Mustang redesign while great added weight and the 2016 Camaro went on a serious diet. While the GT350 is a great package, it's cost plus ADM make the SS 1LE a better value. The R is in a different category but for the price, a Corvette MAY be a better value for performance (two different types of cars I know). The GT/ZR1 comparison is strictly a media pissing contest for headlines. The GT is the better car period. 
 
Now history has a habit of repeating itself, if you look at sales. With the exception of a few months here and there, the Mustang has outsold the Camaro. It's been pretty significant too. While Big Al at Chevy loves the performance bragging rights, 95% of the people who own these cars don't track it. Daily driving becomes more of a factor. Will the Camaro survive, probably but the car is shares it's platform with is barely selling as well. I would absolutely laugh if they discontinued the Camaro again.


Exactly. GM puts a priority on beating Ford performance by throwing big honking engines in otherwise unattractive packages with teeth jarring springs. And for no other reason than bragging rights. They certainly don’t sell better.

There is no reason for Ford to respond to any of that. They build performance vehicles you can live with everyday and if that means losing a couple of seconds on the track, so be it.

Yes, it’s nice to have Ford bragging rights but you can’t take those to the bank.

2018 F150 Supercab XLT Sport (Magnetic) - 3.5LEB
2016 Lincoln MKX Reserve (Luxe/Cappucino)


#26 OFFLINE   bluetoy

bluetoy

    New BON Member

  • Blue Oval Member
  • Pip
  • 26 posts
  • Joined 02-September 10

Posted 25 February 2018 - 01:02 PM

There are plenty of unsold GT350's around that can be had under sticker. In the early fall the local dealer here had several new GT350's for 10k under sticker. They still have a couple. To me that is better than a weird looking Camaro. As far as the Vette beating the GT, there is no comparison. different days, different drivers. Means nothing at all.










Custom Search


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Privacy Policy Terms of Service | DMCA ·