SoonerLS Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Just go ahead and buy an Edge. You'll get there sooner or later. Too much kid crap to haul around in a sedan or even a small hatchback. MKC. If we're spending fuzzy's money, let's do it right. Years ago, I had my brother's three eldest girls in the back seat of my LS. They were, IIRC, 5, 3, and 1, with two forward-facing seats in the outer positions and one rearward-facing seat in the middle. It worked for running around Denton, but I wouldn't want to do much more (or go very far) like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Agree. If we didn't have 3, we'd probably have an Edge. It's the perfect size, but sitting 3 across is a bit small for kiddos and car seats. We may explore (no pun intended) an Edge next since the kids are all out of boosters. Yeah, figured as much based on your earlier comments. It is pretty big, but it's super for kids and a great highway cruiser. We love ours. Nearly 9 years and 111k in. I'm winning! I'll have had mine 9 years in November, and have 114K on it. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 I'm winning! I'll have had mine 9 years in November, and have 114K on it. :P We've had ours longer...9 years in September! :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
630land Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 I bet ex poster "Biker##" is having fits about this, wishing for EU gas prices and taxes. When time comes for new car will shop around other brands, but still look at Mk4. Or Escape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fgts Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 (edited) A lot of what's been learned with escort and competitors like Corrola and Cruze is being baked into the next gen Focus. That the car comes from an extremely low cost production centre is an added bonus to the mix and will give Ford more room to price accordingly.without fear of insufficient profit. I would sooner see $1 Billion in up fromt production savings being spent on more US product and being lost in the clatter of keeping Focus American made to a buying segment that's price.sensitive. That's still a problem. In the 70s-00s the US car makers couldn't make little to no money on efficient cars. Now Detroit have their books cleaned in one way or another Ford IMO still have no real reason to go to China for a mainstream model especially with black-ink books and efficient, profitable truck/suv/cuvs Someone mentioned in here M. Feilds coulda got fired because he felt the same way but greedy boardmembers felt they needed top dollar for everything made without considering long term reputation damage. Edited June 22, 2017 by Fgts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 That's still a problem. In the 70s-00s the US car makers couldn't make little to no money on efficient cars. Now Detroit have their books cleaned in one way or another Ford IMO still have no real reason to go to China for a mainstream model especially with black-ink books and efficient, profitable truck/suv/cuvs Someone mentioned in here M. Feilds coulda got fired because he felt the same way but greedy boardmembers felt they needed top dollar for everything made without considering long term reputation damage. They already said it actually costs more to import them from China, so it's not so much about profitability as it is about factory capacity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 I hope, as it's been suggested, that this is really a capacity issue with a long term goal of returning production to North America somewhere, however I'm not terribly optimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 They already said it actually costs more to import them from China, so it's not so much about profitability as it is about factory capacity. On a whole, I think the picture that emerges out of this is that Fields was fired basically because he wanted to invest $1 billion in Saint Luis Potosi to build Focus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 I would think the more reasons than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 On a whole, I think the picture that emerges out of this is that Fields was fired basically because he wanted to invest $1 billion in Saint Luis Potosi to build Focus. Or was it because he cancelled the plans to build that plant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 hasn't everyone been saying that Ford has had some sort of capacity issue since 2005 or so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 On a whole, I think the picture that emerges out of this is that Fields was fired basically because he wanted to invest $1 billion in Saint Luis Potosi to build Focus. Pretty much..the capacity issue as reason for china builds is pure bs...there is no dime to be made building that car at map and i still think mexico is retooled for small suv production...the entire capacity issue is ford does not want to expand production at uaw plants..ford can now shut down lousville and move it to map... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 MKC. If we're spending fuzzy's money, let's do it right. Years ago, I had my brother's three eldest girls in the back seat of my LS. They were, IIRC, 5, 3, and 1, with two forward-facing seats in the outer positions and one rearward-facing seat in the middle. It worked for running around Denton, but I wouldn't want to do much more (or go very far) like that. No Neither of us are luxury car types. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 (edited) Or was it because he cancelled the plans to build that plant? Fields committed to the plant in Sep 2016. Ford reversed the decision in Jan 2017. When something like that happens this fast, it usually means the original decision wasn't fully supported and large enough faction of people got to enough board members to force a new evaluation. And we have in hindsight a 3rd data point: Fields was fired in May 2017. So in retrospect, his job was probably already lost in Jan 2017. Remember the word of the street was that Fields didn't move fast enough on the EV front and let other company stole the lead. Investing in a small car assembly plant instead of fast tracking the EV development was probably seen as a bad decision. And so it was reversed almost immediately. If he was fired for cancelling the plant, then the correction would be to expand capacity again in Mexico. But Ford didn't do that. This is my opinion. I'm not stating it as fact. Edited June 22, 2017 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Pretty much..the capacity issue as reason for china builds is pure bs...there is no dime to be made building that car at map and i still think mexico is retooled for small suv production...the entire capacity issue is ford does not want to expand production at uaw plants..ford can now shut down lousville and move it to map... How/why would they shut down Louisville......the only plant making Escape/MKC?? To move them to a plant that already has other products slated for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 (edited) the correction would be to expand capacity again in Mexico. But Ford didn't do that. They didn't do it yet. I have a feeling they might resurrect it. But you're right, we're both just guessing. I don't think that was the biggest factor in Field's firing for sure. Edited June 22, 2017 by akirby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 How/why would they shut down Louisville......the only plant making Escape/MKC?? To move them to a plant that already has other products slated for it? Didn't engage brain before typing?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 .the capacity issue as reason for china builds is pure bs No, it's not given where they are at currently. Map is promised to Ranger/Bronco. Hermosillo still needs to build Fusions and MKZs and with some updates they'll still sell enough to keep the plant occupied. They need overflow for Escape. FRAP is already being expanded. Truck and van plants are full. So are Chicago and Oakville and you have new CD6 vehicles coming. WHERE WOULD YOU PUT FOCUS IN MID TO LATE 2018???? That's not enough time to build a new factory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Well..anything unprofitable is going out of the country to be built..its obvious to me you cannot build a small car in this country using uaw labor...you need to have $48k F150's to do it and you have to hope like hell the bottom dont fall out of the market... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 How/why would they shut down Louisville......the only plant making Escape/MKC?? To move them to a plant that already has other products slated for it? Because he's anti-union and doesn't know what he's talking about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Well..anything unprofitable is going out of the country to be built..its obvious to me you cannot build a small car in this country using uaw labor...you need to have $48k F150's to do it and you have to hope like hell the bottom dont fall out of the market... While F Series is critical to Ford achieving those high profits, there is room below that to value add with lots of products that reside in the space between Focus and F150. And really, with Focus out of the equation, there's Louisville (Escape / MKC), Flat Rock (Mustang / Continental) and Avon Lake (SD and MD). So throw MAP in there with (Ranger / Bronco) and Flat Rock II with future EV SUV and I think that US product is both balanced and profitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 While F Series is critical to Ford achieving those high profits, there is room below that to value add with lots of products that reside in the space between Focus and F150. And really, with Focus out of the equation, there's Louisville (Escape / MKC), Flat Rock (Mustang / Continental) and Avon Lake (SD and MD). So throw MAP in there with (Ranger / Bronco) and Flat Rock II with future EV SUV and I think that US product is both balanced and profitable. except it will never be profitable because UAW #troll logic #stupid opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 except it will never be profitable because UAW #troll logic #stupid opinion Yeah and fortunately, most here understand that while US production is more expensive, the reality that "made in America" is a key expectation with strategically important products. Wen I mused about moving Fusion / MKZ production to FRAP, that's probably not possible but thinking of a way to have three full shifts at a plant right near where you live... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) On a whole, I think the picture that emerges out of this is that Fields was fired basically because he wanted to invest $1 billion in Saint Luis Potosi to build Focus. He lost the trust of the board and especially Bill Ford. According to “Autoline,” things were so strained between Bill Ford and Mark Fields, they hadn’t talked directly in weeks. Edited June 23, 2017 by mackinaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Her thoughts on the Escape so far: Not a fan of the height but I could tolerate it for driving if I had to. Difficult to get him [the little guy] into the car, worse getting out. I like the height of the trunk but feel a fusion has more trunk space overall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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