People leaving at TCAP

[DSenstad]

There are a few ideas being floated at TCAP regarding allowing the people who want to leave to do so. Most of the talk is concerning the production people which I will address first, the second part will be concerning an idea for the maintenance people.

 

Production

 

TCAP is losing a shift which will be about 600 people. When the people were surveyed over 900 people wanted a package, not including those who want to transfer. The local union has said its position is to help their members move on if moving on is what they want to do. The local leadership proposed an idea where all 900+ would be allowed to leave and the extra jobs would be covered by TPTers. When the plant goes to one shift, not everyone will be on the same job as they were on originally so there will be some training that is necessary. That would mean roughly 400-500 people will be able to take the packages immediately... my position is if that is what they want, to move on with their lives I'm glad to see a program to help them. When the people are all trained the remaining 150-200 people who were kept to keep the line running will be allowed to begin their new lives, again, good for them. At this time, hopefully before, the company will begin hiring the TPTers. I would advocate hiring them as soon a they send out the initial 400+ to help start the training since they usually only bring in 25 or so in each group for training purposes, however with the on location school/training center and auditorium they might be able to hire more at each time than ever before. Once they have the necessary numbers of TPTers trained they will be able to let the last 300+ people who wanted to go begin life after Ford. It could be possible to allow the first two swings to go in lump sums and then allow the last group to trickle out as people are trained on those jobs.

 

Anybody see any problem with this?

 

Skilled Trades

 

With the reduction of a shift, most of the people on the midnights (#1) shift will be eliminated. It was originally thought that only that amount of workers would be allowed to go leaving many to wait anxiously to see what their future might hold. Many of the maintenance people would also like to start looking for career #2, 3, 4... Whatever, these people would not be provided the same opportunities.

 

A new idea was brought up to the local leadership which they are now mulling over. Many of the outside unions have wanted to staff the plant for a long time; it might be a good time to bring some of those workers in. The company has concerns that the outside people wouldn't know what they are suppose to do for at least a year... or the balance of our plat being open. It was then suggested that the outside local hire many of these people who wanted to leave and bring them back into the plant. That would give these people who want to leave Ford a chance to get there foot in a local union and start to build seniority within those locals and at the same time staff Ford so they can continue to run and build a quality product... :rolleyes: OK, as good as they can with the TPTers and the attitude people will unfortunately have knowing the end is coming. :shrug:

 

There is some concern that people might be offended if the guy they work next to takes the buy out, then comes back in on Monday with an extra $100,000 (minus taxes) in their pocket. I understand that the money means they are out of the Ford system forever and so it doesn't affect me in the least. I also would prefer having those guys coming back so I would have to carry anyone for the months (year) it might take them to catch on.

 

I see it as a win-win. What are your thoughts and are any other plants exploring these options? If not, why not?

[RichardJensen]

Just an aside: I think these buyouts should be seen as the UAW's last, best, gift to Ford workers. Despite Ford's patrician attitude towards its employees and communities, I doubt they'd be so generous without the UAW prodding them.

[Sizzler]

...That would mean roughly 400-500 people will be able to take the packages immediately... my position is if that is what they want, to move on with their lives I'm glad to see a program to help them. When the people are all trained the remaining 150-200 people who were kept to keep the line running will be allowed to begin their new lives, again, good for them. ...

 

Anybody see any problem with this?

 

So assuming a given number of slots to be filled outside of Ford employment in the area, 400-500 people would get a jump on those slots before the remaining 150-200 employees who are most 'loyal' to the plant can have a shot at them?

 

Would there be an increase in the package offered the last 200 employees?

 

Isn't this what the skilled trades people are worried about? They don't want shift #1 people out there grabbing spots before they get a chance too? They want everyone out looking at once, with a fallback position being a local union position?

[DSenstad]

So assuming a given number of slots to be filled outside of Ford employment in the area, 400-500 people would get a jump on those slots before the remaining 150-200 employees who are most 'loyal' to the plant can have a shot at them?

 

Would there be an increase in the package offered the last 200 employees?

 

Isn't this what the skilled trades people are worried about? They don't want shift #1 people out there grabbing spots before they get a chance too? They want everyone out looking at once, with a fallback position being a local union position?

I don't read the help wanted section that often, I usually will browse it when the mood hits me, that might be changing now. My point for telling you is that there are always different jobs open when I read it. Just because someone got a job this month doesn't mean someone will not be retiring from a better job next month. It's a crap shoot either way. I don't think the 150-200 can be considered "most loyal" since the people being bought out first would most likely be determined by senority.

 

The 200 who took the buy outs but had the lowest senority and had to stay the longest would still be acting under the same buy out plan so it would all be equal. I guess if they were concerned enough about being the first out the door they could jump ship prior to the buy outs. There will be some that opt for none at this time. They will could be affected package wise in a future round since no one seems to have a decent crystal ball.

 

Most of the #1 shifts tradesman slots will be eliminated by the retirement package. I am skilled trades and know of people who might not get to go since they might not have enough years... they only have 30. :rolleyes: No, being first out the door to get a chance at a new job isn't a large concern to the trades.

[Sizzler]

...The 200 who took the buy outs but had the lowest senority and had to stay the longest would still be acting under the same buy out plan so it would all be equal. I guess if they were concerned enough about being the first out the door they could jump ship prior to the buy outs. There will be some that opt for none at this time. They will could be affected package wise in a future round since no one seems to have a decent crystal ball...

 

not quite following why seniority would allow you to leave earlier. I would think that given the benefits situation in your employment market, not to mention the pay rates, that anyone who COULD stay (assuming they suffer no disadvantages in the after-Ford job market as you imply they won't), would stay. Why would they want to leave? Isn't the buyout amount PLUS earnings (and benefits) for up to a year equal to more than just a buyout?

 

and why would jumping ship before the buyout be in any sane person's plans unless there's some fantastic position waiting for them?

 

What type of job-equivalent positions are available there, in the want-ads you're reading?

[DSenstad]

not quite following why seniority would allow you to leave earlier. I would think that given the benefits situation in your employment market, not to mention the pay rates, that anyone who COULD stay (assuming they suffer no disadvantages in the after-Ford job market as you imply they won't), would stay. Why would they want to leave? Isn't the buyout amount PLUS earnings (and benefits) for up to a year equal to more than just a buyout?

 

and why would jumping ship before the buyout be in any sane person's plans unless there's some fantastic position waiting for them?

 

What type of job-equivalent positions are available there, in the want-ads you're reading?

One of the buy out packages is an additional $35,000 if you retire isn't it? Someone who is in that position might find it the right push wouldn't they? As far as others, do you think not really knowing your end date or what the future holds is a walk in the park? I think most people who are in that situation, or have been, would say it is a 24 hour concern whether they are actively thinking about it or whether it is simply on the edges of their mind. Simply put, there is a relief factor in making a decision. Can you tell me the exact date TCAP will be closing on?

 

Would I consider jumping ship early, pre buy outs sane? No. If someone felt they needed to be the first out into the job market it is a choice they have to make themselves.

 

I assume you read my entire post, then you would see that I am skilled trades. The trades in Minnesota often make more money that we do inside the plant. We do have better medical/dental/optical and vacations although they generally have a better retirement pay out, I think many of them are near the $75 a year rate as opposed to Fords $55 or there about. We have in the past also had much better overtime opportunity but that has long gone by the wayside.

 

 

Just an aside: I think these buyouts should be seen as the UAW's last, best, gift to Ford workers. Despite Ford's patrician attitude towards its employees and communities, I doubt they'd be so generous without the UAW prodding them.

I did mean to respond to this earlier. I consider the buy out package to be the working mans golden.... well more of a bronze balloon than a golden parachute but it is something.