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Fallout: Massacre @ Cinema 9


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First and foremost, I would like to express my deepest sympathy and condolences for the victims and families of the recent terror attack in Aurora, Colorado. You are all in my prayers.

 

Second, I would like to thank the 911 operators, first responders, the Aurora Police Department, hospital staff, and the private EOD contractors that were involved. Many are still.

 

That said, I would like to hear some of the BON members thoughts on the fallout of this attack.

 

I have a few questions though. Why wasn't anyone in that theatre sufficiently armed to neutralise the assalant? How was one man able to acquire so much tactical equipment without a class 3 license? Where was the FBI? The ATF? Should private security contractors be required in areas (or at events) where so many people are packed in such a confined space?

Edited by Versa-Tech
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It's a shame this happened, and the individual in question was obviously fairly ill.

 

Just because the theater had people in it doesn't mean (statistically speaking) that someone with a CCW permit was there. The flip side to that is, someone could have been armed, but simply panicked and chose not to use their concealed weapon. It does happen. Some people talk a very good talk about what they would do with their firearm in an emergency, but freeze in that critical moment. It happens to highly trained professionals in law enforcement, the military, and certainly at the civilian level.

 

I have a lot of cop friends (LAPD, LAS, OCS, BHPD to name a few) and they always say they get tired of hearing about what an "armchair cop" would have done in a given situation because they really have no idea (no one does) until they are in it. There is what they are trained to do, then there is what they actually do. Not always the same.

 

I don't know how he acquired his equipment. Did he have a FFL?

 

It would be cost prohibitive to hire private security for all theaters. Profit margins are likely very tight as it is. (Although sounds like a great job for some National Guard greenhorns).

 

I always said that if a terrorist organization wanted to bring our economy to it's knees, it would only have to send a few suicide bombers to target movie theaters and malls. Make people afraid to gather in public areas and spend money, and that would do it. This is not a country used to such actions. Initially people would be terrified, and having a concealed weapon would make no difference.

Edited by the_spaniard
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Simple numbers but there are more armed individuals among us than armed law enforcement officers, wanting a cop everywhere is not realistic or practical. You have a greater chance of running into civilian with a weapon of law enforcement.

It's too bad someone could not have dropped the guy before he killed and wounded so many. That's not an armchair cop, that's protecting yourself or family.

 

The one instance that stick in my mind is an armed security guard or similar at a church that dropped a gunman before he got rolling. Once in a while the "good guys" stop the idiots in their tracks.

 

(It was in Denver, Co.)

 

http://fwd4.me/16IT

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It's a shame this happened, and the individual in question was obviously fairly ill.

 

Just because the theater had people in it doesn't mean (statistically speaking) that someone with a CCW permit was there. The flip side to that is, someone could have been armed, but simply panicked and chose not to use their concealed weapon. It does happen. Some people talk a very good talk about what they would do with their firearm in an emergency, but freeze in that critical moment. It happens to highly trained professionals in law enforcement, the military, and certainly at the civilian level.

 

I have a lot of cop friends (LAPD, LAS, OCS, BHPD to name a few) and they always say they get tired of hearing about what an "armchair cop" would have done in a given situation because they really have no idea (no one does) until they are in it. There is what they are trained to do, then there is what they actually do. Not always the same.

 

I don't know how he acquired his equipment. Did he have a FFL?

 

It would be cost prohibitive to hire private security for all theaters. Profit margins are likely very tight as it is. (Although sounds like a great job for some National Guard greenhorns).

 

I always said that if a terrorist organization wanted to bring our economy to it's knees, it would only have to send a few suicide bombers to target movie theaters and malls. Make people afraid to gather in public areas and spend money, and that would do it. This is not a country used to such actions. Initially people would be terrified, and having a concealed weapon would make no difference.

Question: What is a "National Guard greenhorn"? Edited by napfirst
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Those are some good points. I've heard talk of placing metal detectors in public venues, but considering that this guy was decked out in body armor and camo, having used the emergency exit to get in, those measures would not have prevented this particular situation. I would say that if this guy would have walked through the front door wearing that gear, he would have been apprehended by the security standards already in place. Perhaps fire exit standards and procedures should be looked at.

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This is a shame and proves government alone is not the answer.

http://www.informati...n.com/?id=40267

Just a few days ago there was a widely covered story when a 71-year-old man shot some robbers who entered an internet cafe armed with guns:

 

Of course, there was no police there to protect the people above in the internet cafe, nor was there any police to protect those during the Dark Knight shooting. As anyone who follows this site knows, the police generally act as revenue collection agencies for the state, violating people's rights just like armed robbers, rather than act to protect people from criminals, they act to protect the criminal state from the people.

 

The "government," or the people who call themselves "the government," are more likely to violate your rights than any random criminal, yet for the most part it's entirely illegal to defend yourself against government robbery and any state sanctioned "use of force."

 

To depend on these people for "protection" is foolish to the extreme, those who believe such nonsense put us all in danger.

 

528837_332530130168384_117762849_n.jpg

Edited by fmccap
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So anyone who hasn't served in a combat zone is a "greenhorn"?.........interesting......

 

That was my understanding, but then again I heard it from my army buddy (from Oklahoma) who served during OIF. :)

 

I wasn't implying that an armed citizen is an "armchair cop", only those that criticize an officers actions in the moment without actually being there. I too, wish someone would have dropped this kid before he did any damage.

 

And for the record, I'm looking into getting a CCW permit for a stint I have coming up in NC. I don't have a problem with a responsible citizen being armed.

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So anyone who hasn't served in a combat zone is a "greenhorn"?.........interesting......

Uhh, they are soldiers, right?

 

I said "combat scenario", which could occur anywhere, just to make the distinction. In any case, I would much rather have someone, who has been shot at, by my side in a combat scenario, rather than some ranking training expert who's going to shit himself at the first sight of muzzle flash. There are many "civilians" that are far more capable in such conditions than a guy in uniform. It's certainly not common, but not an exception in any regard.

 

That said, I would take any battle-tested national guard combatant over a highly trained civilian as well.

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Uhh, they are soldiers, right?

 

I said "combat scenario", which could occur anywhere, just to make the distinction. In any case, I would much rather have someone, who has been shot at, by my side in a combat scenario, rather than some ranking training expert who's going to shit himself at the first sight of muzzle flash. There are many "civilians" that are far more capable in such conditions than a guy in uniform. It's certainly not common, but not an exception in any regard.

 

That said, I would take any battle-tested national guard combatant over a highly trained civilian as well.

Sorry not my intent to side-track this post........the greenhorn comment piqued my interest.......

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I have a few questions though. Why wasn't anyone in that theatre sufficiently armed to neutralise the assalant? How was one man able to acquire so much tactical equipment without a class 3 license? Where was the FBI? The ATF? Should private security contractors be required in areas (or at events) where so many people are packed in such a confined space?

 

I have those same questions.

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First and foremost, I would like to express my deepest sympathy and condolences for the victims and families of the recent terror attack in Aurora, Colorado. You are all in my prayers.

 

Second, I would like to thank the 911 operators, first responders, the Aurora Police Department, hospital staff, and the private EOD contractors that were involved. Many are still.

 

That said, I would like to hear some of the BON members thoughts on the fallout of this attack.

 

I have a few questions though. Why wasn't anyone in that theatre sufficiently armed to neutralise the assalant? How was one man able to acquire so much tactical equipment without a class 3 license? Where was the FBI? The ATF? Should private security contractors be required in areas (or at events) where so many people are packed in such a confined space?

 

He might have acquired them illegally in which case BATF wouldn't be aware he had them.

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I'm so sick and tired of folks blaming these awful events on illnesses. It's just plain evil and needs to be dealt with accordingly. There was nothing wrong with the young man other than he listens to too much radio and news networks he's a flipped out nutcase that derserves the death penalty.

 

Mark's gonna hate this part - with this many eye witnesses (sp?) don;t even waste tax dollars on a trial, he deserves to be toasted.

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He might have acquired them illegally in which case BATF wouldn't be aware he had them.

As I understand it, he acquired everything by mail, except the weapons. The guns were purchased legally (he wasn't a felon, previously) abiding by whatever ordinances/waiting periods applied.

 

You cannot stop a man who is intent on harm, and patient.

 

As to the man, he's a loner, left with his delusions to guide him.

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I'm so sick and tired of folks blaming these awful events on illnesses. It's just plain evil and needs to be dealt with accordingly. There was nothing wrong with the young man other than he listens to too much radio and news networks.

 

Yes, I'm sure talk radio (read: "right-wing" talk radio, for those of you in Yorba Linda) filled his head with the idea that he's the Joker.

Edited by RangerM
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And for the record, I'm looking into getting a CCW permit for a stint I have coming up in NC. I don't have a problem with a responsible citizen being armed.

You're apparently planning on hanging out in South Charlotte or Durham a lot. Be sure to catch a baseball game while you're here.

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Mark's gonna hate this part - with this many eye witnesses (sp?) don;t even waste tax dollars on a trial, he deserves to be toasted.

 

 

Same as the Ft.Hood shooter (Major Hassan ?)

 

No doubt you have the right guy, just get some rope.

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He might have acquired them illegally in which case BATF wouldn't be aware he had them.

 

 

The BATFE was aware (Running) of Fast & Furious which they funded weapons purchase & distribution that killed more people + two federal agents.

No news outcry for their mass murders with weapons they provided.

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The BATFE was aware (Running) of Fast & Furious which they funded weapons purchase & distribution that killed more people + two federal agents.

No news outcry for their mass murders with weapons they provided.

Well, Fox News did. Talk radio (on both sides) certainly did. Internet based media has as well. The only people who were late to the party were the majors, msnbc, and cnn; which are considered B list by the majority anyway. The whole mainstream media argument isn't really relevant anymore as far as bias goes. There might be a higher quantity of mediums that lean left, but the rightwing media , as focused as it is, destroys them every day as far as viewership, listeners go.
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What really shames me about the gun debate in America is that neither side is willing to step back, let the fear, grief and general agony of situations like this subside before engaging in their extreme forms of rhetoric. Critical thinking is not done in haste while both sides are filled with emotion. We as a nation need to figure out a better solution to a serious issue and neither side is being logical about it. You can not disarm enough people (which I don't advocate for) nor arm enough people to get our gun violence rate to the level it should be. Personally i hate both thoughts on the subject. I refuse to live in either fear filled world and find that this is the single greatest failure of America.

 

I want to raise my children somewhere that I can choose to own guns as I please without having to carry a gun because that might be the only way to be safe. I refuse to be a stooge for either side and live in either world of fear. If I die because I own guns and do not carry then so be it. I will not consider my life to be a potential combat zone. Unless the zombies comes, then it's Woody Harrelson time.

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