mettech Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Where is the trend heading.... http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3022-autosales.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Unless your adversaries are picking up all of the market increase... and with lower rebates.. The one issue with the rebates is how they are being applied...getting a rebate on a 40k+ product isn't the same as getting a 2K rebate on a product that costs 20K or so. Ford sells more big money F-150s with a 2-4K rebate (haven't looked what they are excatly) that helps drive their averages higher... Ford at the moment is right at the industry average and they are burning off two big older products...the Escape and Fusion over the next couple months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Not possible. Must be a typo. Should have been killed last year. Nobody wants them. Yes because a month or two makes a sales trend. Explorer is doing MUCH better then the Flex yet around here Flex is seen as the more important of the two. I don't get that. Give it a few months and Flex (along with it's sexy sister) will be down again. Explorer continues to move ahead and still no Lincoln version coming anytime soon. The MKT isn't what Lincoln needs if they want a chance at re-inventing themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Yes because a month or two makes a sales trend. Explorer is doing MUCH better then the Flex yet around here Flex is seen as the more important of the two. I don't get that. Give it a few months and Flex (along with it's sexy sister) will be down again. Explorer continues to move ahead and still no Lincoln version coming anytime soon. The MKT isn't what Lincoln needs if they want a chance at re-inventing themselves. Oh stop it. You know darn well that if the Flex had one reaolly bad month you'd be all over it. You're ignoring the fact that the sales reflect a new design making it more than just a blip. No guarantees of course but it sure appears the new face is driving higher sales, at least for now. Nobody ever said the Flex was important. All we said was it deserved to stay around due to high ATPs and high conquest rates especially in California where the imports have traditionally fared a lot better than Ford. If Ford decides to kill it in 2 years we'll all be fine with that, too. Nobody really likes the MKT either but it could have a place in the livery market business - it's too early to tell. However, you can't simply point to low sales volume in a vacuum and say it should be killed because it only sells X. You have to look at it in terms of its market segment and market share. The best selling $50K luxury crossover won't come close to the 6th place midsize sedan in sales. Apples and oranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 We read months and months ago about the MKT taking place of the Town Car, yet havent seen signs of that taking place. I mean, if the MKT numbers reflect livery this month, I can imagine without livery what it would be. That vehicle can't die fast enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Where is the trend heading.... http://online.wsj.co...-autosales.html Good info - thanks mettech! The graphic above represents 12 month rolling averages of U.S. market share of the five largest OEMs over a yearly period. Very useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted May 2, 2012 Author Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) We read months and months ago about the MKT taking place of the Town Car, yet havent seen signs of that taking place. I mean, if the MKT numbers reflect livery this month, I can imagine without livery what it would be. That vehicle can't die fast enough. The MKT "Town Car" launched with the 2013 model, which has only been in production for 4 weeks. Edited May 2, 2012 by PREMiERdrum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Nobody ever said the Flex was important. Mark Fields indicated the Flex was important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 We read months and months ago about the MKT taking place of the Town Car, yet havent seen signs of that taking place. I mean, if the MKT numbers reflect livery this month, I can imagine without livery what it would be. That vehicle can't die fast enough. They just need to relaunch it based on the Explorer instead of the Flex. Problem solved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyairtime Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The Ranger has been beat to death but I'm here because I just started researching the 2012 and found it doesn't exist. The ranger was dropped because of fear plain and simple. Fear that it would cut into the #1 truck in America. There's another problem and that is executives totally out of touch with the market. The exec in the article I read stated that a guy like me would switch to a Focus to commute in. That logic spells trouble for Ford. You can't bring home a sheet of plywood in a Focus. Fear and lack of imagination doesn't make you a market leader or bode well for Ford in the near future. They could dominate the mini truck market by bringing their 30 mpg front wheel drive world truck here and labeling it as a Ranger but they think 18 year old motocrossers and delivery services need a luxury suv. Say what you will but the Ranger will go down in history as a blunder and front drive mini world trucks will be a huge hit here, but Ford won't be leading the way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Mark Fields indicated the Flex was important. Where? Flex appeals to people who want to stand out from the crowd, and it has the highest retention rate of any vehicle in the Ford lineup,” said Mark Fields, Ford president of The Americas. “With technologies not found in other full-size utilities, even better fuel economy and a more modern, sophisticated look, the new model offers people even more reasons to choose Flex All he says is that it has high retention rates - not that it's important to Ford's bottom line or that it's more important than the Explorer or other vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The Ranger has been beat to death but I'm here because I just started researching the 2012 and found it doesn't exist. The ranger was dropped because of fear plain and simple. Fear that it would cut into the #1 truck in America. There's another problem and that is executives totally out of touch with the market. The exec in the article I read stated that a guy like me would switch to a Focus to commute in. That logic spells trouble for Ford. You can't bring home a sheet of plywood in a Focus. Fear and lack of imagination doesn't make you a market leader or bode well for Ford in the near future. You have no idea what you're talking about. What Ford says publicly has nothing to do with their internal business plans. The old Ranger wasn't viable and the new one isn't ready yet. When the market is only 250K vehicles or less what does it mean to "dominate" that market? 100K? 150K? And what does it cost for that domination vs. how much profit can be made? They could dominate the mini truck market by bringing their 30 mpg front wheel drive world truck here and labeling it as a Ranger but they think 18 year old motocrossers and delivery services need a luxury suv. Say what you will but the Ranger will go down in history as a blunder and front drive mini world trucks will be a huge hit here, but Ford won't be leading the way. Which 30 mpg FWD world truck is that? And how do you know Ford isn't already planning to offer something like that? I guarantee there will be a new Ford truck within 2 years that will offer best in class fuel economy. Whether that's a smaller, lighter F150, F100, Ranger or unibody based is TBD. But which do you think is more important? A F100 that still functions as a full sized work truck but gets 4 mpg better than the best full sized pickup today that can compete in a market of 1.5M - 2M vehicles or something that only competes in the small truck segment in a market of 250K tops (and falling)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Where? All he says is that it has high retention rates - not that it's important to Ford's bottom line or that it's more important than the Explorer or other vehicles. has ford ever said that about any vehicle? I don't think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 has ford ever said that about any vehicle? I don't think so. Yes. They have said the F-Series is their most important line of vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Explorer is doing MUCH better then the Flex yet around here Flex is seen as the more important of the two. has ford ever said that about any vehicle? I don't think so. I was referring to 2005Explorer's statement that around here Flex is seen as more important than the explorer. Nobody here or at Ford has ever said anything remotely resembling that statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I was referring to 2005Explorer's statement that around here Flex is seen as more important than the explorer. Nobody here or at Ford has ever said anything remotely resembling that statement. Ford hasn't said it, but I know there are some fans here that would prefer Ford to focus on that vehicle line in marketing and promotion over the Explorer. In my opinion, Ford can play around with a niche product like Flex if they want, but Explorer should be priority in marketing, promotion and assembly capacity. The MKT might have it's fans around here, but take out the handful of livery sales and what's left? Why are they messing around selling a handful of those whales when an attractive Explorer based Lincoln could be selling right along. Whoever greenlighted that disaster in styling had too much to drink that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkarlo Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Hmmm, Ford's own data raises questions with that line of argument. First, its inventories were up a bit: 66 days' supply in April, versus 58 days' worth in March. Second, and somewhat surprisingly, Ford's fleet sales were up in April relative to its total. Ford sales analyst Erich Merkle said on Tuesday that fleet sales represented 37% of its April totals. Seems to me that Ford could have sold more Fiestas, Escapes, Mustangs, Tauruses, MKZ's, and MKT's. For that matter, another few thousand more Fusions too. No shortage of Fusions on dealer lots around here. Shortage of Focus though, and Fiestas are in very plentiful supply. So a good month for Ford to me would have been about another 10,000 units sold. I bought a Focus the other day. The dealer didn't have that many in stock. The ones they did, were mainly the unpopular colors, and models. It's not just the amount there have in inventory, it's the type too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) Ford hasn't said it, but I know there are some fans here that would prefer Ford to focus on that vehicle line in marketing and promotion over the Explorer. Huh? I'm one of the Flex supporters (partially because we have one), but I don't recall anyone here that has said the Flex should get priority over Explorer in marketing and promotion. In my opinion, Ford can play around with a niche product like Flex if they want, but Explorer should be priority in marketing, promotion and assembly capacity. You give assembly capacity priority to whatever is selling AND making the most money for you. You give marketing and promotion to whatever has the most potential to sell AND make money, and that changes by market. You don't pick out one vehicle and say it has marketing and promotion priority. The MKT might have it's fans around here, but take out the handful of livery sales and what's left? Why are they messing around selling a handful of those whales when an attractive Explorer based Lincoln could be selling right along. Whoever greenlighted that disaster in styling had too much to drink that day. You do know that an Explorer-based Lincoln is on the way, right? Edited May 2, 2012 by fordmantpw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 You do know that an Explorer-based Lincoln is on the way, right? In 4 or 5 years? If one drops in the next year or two I'll be very surpised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted May 2, 2012 Author Share Posted May 2, 2012 In 4 or 5 years? If one drops in the next year or two I'll be very surpised. Launching next year as a 2014 model, if things haven't changed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Ford hasn't said it, but I know there are some fans here that would prefer Ford to focus on that vehicle line in marketing and promotion over the Explorer. In my opinion, Ford can play around with a niche product like Flex if they want, but Explorer should be priority in marketing, promotion and assembly capacity. The MKT might have it's fans around here, but take out the handful of livery sales and what's left? Why are they messing around selling a handful of those whales when an attractive Explorer based Lincoln could be selling right along. Whoever greenlighted that disaster in styling had too much to drink that day. Wow. I don't know what alternate reality you've been living in. Nobody here has EVER said or implied that the Flex was more important than the Explorer. Never. Ever. Not even close. What you and others have said is that it should be killed because of low sales volume and we tried to explain why Ford decided to keep it around and not kill it right now. Same for the MKT. Selling the Flex and MKT now have nothing whatsoever to do with whether they'll have an Explorer based Lincoln. They may have all 4 at some point with the MKT doing mostly livery duty. As long as they're not capacity constrained I don't see the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The thing I'm surprised about is how long its taking for a Lincoln Explorer to hit the market....heck the Explorer has been out for nearly a year and half now and Ford has said squat about a Lincoln based Explorer...so the earliest we'll see it is maybe next Summer? What about the Lincoln Escape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The thing I'm surprised about is how long its taking for a Lincoln Explorer to hit the market....heck the Explorer has been out for nearly a year and half now and Ford has said squat about a Lincoln based Explorer...so the earliest we'll see it is maybe next Summer? What about the Lincoln Escape? That's because Ford is doing it right with Lincoln this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted May 2, 2012 Author Share Posted May 2, 2012 The thing I'm surprised about is how long its taking for a Lincoln Explorer to hit the market....heck the Explorer has been out for nearly a year and half now and Ford has said squat about a Lincoln based Explorer...so the earliest we'll see it is maybe next Summer? What about the Lincoln Escape? MKEscape has been in development much longer, and IIRC it goes into production Q1 of 2013. The Explorer-variant didn't get the green light until close to the 2011 Explorer launch. It's more than just a reskin... expect the Continuously Controlled Dampening, Lincoln SelectDrive, and a host of other changes in transition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The thing I'm surprised about is how long its taking for a Lincoln Explorer to hit the market....heck the Explorer has been out for nearly a year and half now and Ford has said squat about a Lincoln based Explorer...so the earliest we'll see it is maybe next Summer? What about the Lincoln Escape? I don't think they were sure what they wanted to do with Lincoln and the Navigator until recently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.