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August 2011 Sales Results


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Oh no!!! I HATE leather seats!! Hate them!! They are a pain in the butt. They require too much upkeep and no matter how much of that leather conditioner you apply sooner or later the leather just looks old and weathered and wrinkled. I will never own another car with leather seats!! NEVER!!!! So, . . . . no luxury cars for me I guess.

 

 

 

Seriously though, . . . . I hate leather seats. They suck.

 

My wife has a BMW X3 with letherette interior, it is much nicer than leather. Looks great, nicer to sit on, easier to clean, much better than real leather.

Edited by Kev-Mo
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F-series was essentially flat YOY. When did the new engines start hitting lots last year for the F-series?

 

Also, this month GM (Silv/Sierra) outsold F-series. Ford has been outselling them combined most months recently.

 

GM sales up 18%

 

gm sales

 

 

Traverse and Acadia up 30 and 40% - those models have been out for years and viturally unchanged...can anyone shed some light on that knd of sales increase with all the new competition out there? Those vehicles are spanking the new Explorer in sales.

Edited by Kev-Mo
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The current Escape is not just a Mazda 626 on stilts.

And you can't have it both ways, the next Escape Kuga is hardly a Focus on stilts....

 

While Focus, C-Max, Kuga and Escape will share basic engineering and platform, there's a

lot of changes between a Focus and going to something like a Kuga, Escape or even C-Max...

 

Have a bit of faith, Ford is not going to kill off such a wonderful and important small SUV market.

 

Something else to remember:

Sales of Mustang have now slipped to around 5K or 6K/mth due to the economy and much ATP for the V8 GT,

does this give Ford genuine cause for concern, is the market is starting to want something else?

 

Seems like a lot of those ardent drag racing Mustang fans are now mostly buying second hand.....

Edited by jpd80
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If the Mustang looked like a 2 door Fusion, but kept all it's capabilities, or even improved on them a little bit, except instead of the V8 they only offered the Ecoboost V6, would it still be a Mustang? Would people say "so what? Things change."?

 

 

The problem with your argument is your going from a RWD car to a FWD car..the Mustang has always been a RWD car with a V8. The biggest change with the upcoming Escape is with the styling and maybe engines...the platform type is staying the same

 

 

Also the Fusion, a car equally important to Ford and is currently a smash success, is being changed. Why does everyone assume the new style will be a huge hit despite no one outside of Ford has ever viewed it? Couldn't it be argued that at least a part of the Fusion's success may be its styling? No one here seems concerned about that.

 

You bring up a good point about impressions...the "problem" is that People automatically assume that the Mondeo is superior to the current Fusion, thus the lack of backlash with the changes. But since the Escape is changing (which it really isn't) from what people expect people are up in arms about it.

 

 

I don't like the idea that the Escape or Fusion are rumored to be going 4 cylinder only, however it is best not to mention that around here or you will get flamed hard. If you want a V6 in a mid-size sedan or small crossover in the future pay up for a Lincoln or go to another brand.

 

 

Well back in the 1960s you could get a V8 in mid-sized cars...things change and the change to 4 cyc engines is partly due to market conditions (IIRC better then 60% of mid-sized cars are sold with I4's only) and partly due to meeting upcoming EPA CAFE ratings in the future years

 

 

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Well back in the 1960s you could get a V8 in mid-sized cars...things change and the change to 4 cyc engines is partly due to market conditions (IIRC better then 60% of mid-sized cars are sold with I4's only) and partly due to meeting upcoming EPA CAFE ratings in the future years

 

It doesn't mean I or the other 40% who are choosing V6s in those vehicle lines have to like it or think that 4 cylinders are better then V6s.

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The problem with your argument is your going from a RWD car to a FWD car..the Mustang has always been a RWD car with a V8. The biggest change with the upcoming Escape is with the styling and maybe engines...the platform type is staying the same

 

Who said anything about FWD?

 

"If the Mustang looked like a 2 door Fusion, but kept all it's capabilities, or even improved on them a little bit, except instead of the V8 they only offered the Ecoboost V6, would it still be a Mustang? Would people say "so what? Things change."?"

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Traverse and Acadia up 30 and 40% - those models have been out for years and viturally unchanged...can anyone shed some light on that knd of sales increase with all the new competition out there? Those vehicles are spanking the new Explorer in sales.

 

Notice that when the Impala had a production stop and sales went down that Acadia/Traverse sales went up....

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I have to say, I get a big kick out of reading some of the things on here.

 

Everything is not black and white. Those who argue that the Escape has to modernize itself are not saying the current Escape is a failure. Frankly, I have not seen anyone so much as imply that.

 

Trying to compare a 50 yr Icon, with a cute ute is ridiculous. However, if the Mustang were to change as stated, it would lose traditional buyers, and gain new buyers. Those who buy due to the tradition may leave. Those who would never buy due to the deeply seated tradition may buy. Would Ford EVER do this. No. However, to compare an icon like the Mustang to the Escape is pretty silly.

 

Frankly, all of this arguing before we even have the vehicle in front of us, is pretty silly too. Noone has seen the final vehicle. Noone has driven it, or played with the interior. Thus, all of this "Woe is me," over something that noone has so much as seen, is beyond silly, it is ridiculous.

 

There is always the risk when redesigning a popular vehicle. There is resistance to change, from those who love said vehicle. However, I have faith in Ford to do right by the Escape. I loved my Tribute, but would never buy one today. Why?? It just feels "old." I would never buy an Escape now. Why?? Why spend new car money on an old vehicle??

 

People thought that fuel injection would never replace carburators, and they were wrong.

People thought that swoopy midsize cars would never sell like blandmobiles, and they were wrong.

People thought that the end of BOF big cars would be a death call for Ford, and they were wrong.

People thought that new fangled FWD stuff would never catch on, and they were wrong.

People thought that truck buyers would never buy a turbo charged V6 truck, and boy were they wrong.

 

Times change, and products have to change with the times. Do they risk losing some traditional buyers, yes. Can they look forward to pulling in a whole new set of buyers, yes.

 

Finally, the reality is that the Escape is not changing. It will be updating itself. The same formula that works today, can work tomorrow with new, modern, styling. Giving buyers more options is only good for everyone. I say lets see how this vehicle turns out. Frankly, I am excited about it.

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Traverse and Acadia up 30 and 40% - those models have been out for years and viturally unchanged...can anyone shed some light on that knd of sales increase with all the new competition out there? Those vehicles are spanking the new Explorer in sales.

budgetrentacar.jpg

 

Notice that when the Impala had a production stop and sales went down that Acadia/Traverse sales went up....

 

Hmmmm... :shades:

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It doesn't mean I or the other 40% who are choosing V6s in those vehicle lines have to like it or think that 4 cylinders are better then V6s.

No where has Ford said that there isn't going to be a V6 Escape and if that were the case, they would just build Kuga instead...

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Still some posters on here thinking that GM's superior sales means that they are doing better than Ford.

 

How many years are we going to have to go through this until people get it?

Ford cut production levels and started making real money, yet GM keeps flogging the dead horse....

 

We get that Traverse and Arcadia are selling well as is Impala but where are those sales being pumped into?

If that is a good thing, how come GM NA makes 30,000 more sales a month than Ford yet isn't way ahead in profit?

Maybe Ford is smarter than GM.........

Edited by jpd80
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When I recall how the old Big 3 had gigantic fleets of unsold product at model year end, it is great to see Ford increase market share and profit with a minimum inventory. It may take a decade, but it helps keep re-sale values up, which, long-term, helps the brand. How rare for a US company to think about long-term. Bill and Al done good. :)

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When I recall how the old Big 3 had gigantic fleets of unsold product at model year end, it is great to see Ford increase market share and profit with a minimum inventory. It may take a decade, but it helps keep re-sale values up, which, long-term, helps the brand. How rare for a US company to think about long-term. Bill and Al done good. :)

So true Ed, the main thing Mulally brought to Ford was proper corporate governance and strict adherence to efficiency,

right sizing production and ending duplication of product. Some of the fans might not like that Ford is dropping their

favorite products, we get that but isn't better than Ford re establish themselves as the car maker who provides

affordable quality products and technology to the masses?

Ford is arguable delivering far more changes and improvements across the whole showroom starting at base model level,

you don't have to spend a fortune to get a vehicle that looks good, feels right and aims for best in class fuel economy...

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No where has Ford said that there isn't going to be a V6 Escape and if that were the case, they would just build Kuga instead...

 

I just don't see a V6 fitting in a Focus based chassis, but who knows. The current Escape was based on the midsize Mazda 626 which was designed for a V6. The EcoBoost 2.0 will be fine, but wouldn't the D35 be a nice option in the new Escape? I know I'd like it and I bet a decent percentage of buyers would chose it even with an EcoBoost sitting next to it. I believe the Vertrek concept used a 1.6 EcoBoost, however that would be a step backwards performance wise compared to the current D30 V6. I would hope that Ford would not step backwards in regards to performance.

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I just don't see a V6 fitting in a Focus based chassis, but who knows. The current Escape was based on the midsize Mazda 626 which was designed for a V6. The EcoBoost 2.0 will be fine, but wouldn't the D35 be a nice option in the new Escape? I know I'd like it and I bet a decent percentage of buyers would chose it even with an EcoBoost sitting next to it. I believe the Vertrek concept used a 1.6 EcoBoost, however that would be a step backwards performance wise compared to the current D30 V6. I would hope that Ford would not step backwards in regards to performance.

I thought the setup would be EB16 to replace the D25 and EB20 would replace the D30. This would mean better power and fuel efficiency then the current Escape. That sounds like a win/win to me. I don't think we'll see a D35 in the Escape.

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I thought the setup would be EB16 to replace the D25 and EB20 would replace the D30. This would mean better power and fuel efficiency then the current Escape. That sounds like a win/win to me. I don't think we'll see a D35 in the Escape.

 

I'd be surprised if they used 2 different EcoBoost engines especially one as the base engine, but maybe cost has came down enough for it to be possible. Your probably right about the D35, but wouldn't it be fun!:D

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I'd be surprised if they used 2 different EcoBoost engines especially one as the base engine, but maybe cost has came down enough for it to be possible. Your probably right about the D35, but wouldn't it be fun!:D

+1 no doubt. The press release of the original D35 was it was the size of the previous D30 so it would fit.

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I just don't see a V6 fitting in a Focus based chassis, but who knows. The current Escape was based on the midsize Mazda 626 which was designed for a V6. The EcoBoost 2.0 will be fine, but wouldn't the D35 be a nice option in the new Escape? I know I'd like it and I bet a decent percentage of buyers would chose it even with an EcoBoost sitting next to it. I believe the Vertrek concept used a 1.6 EcoBoost, however that would be a step backwards performance wise compared to the current D30 V6. I would hope that Ford would not step backwards in regards to performance.

It depends on the take rate, I think the Escape and Fusion are in the same boat with regards a V6 option,

a 2.0 Ecoboost with Explorer's 240 hp/270 lb ft would be emminately suitable but would buyers accept it

over a V6 option....maybe this is where Ford has to bite the bullet and either appease the US buyer with

a small V6 or go for blitz advertizing on the EB 20 , extolling its virtues...

The number of vehicles getting the EB 20 option says that Ford is tempted but wants buyers to make the call...

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I dont think people will have much of a problem with the 2.0L EB, but it better be pumping out more than 280HP because the competition is near those numbers.

 

Or perhaps Ford is wising up and realizing that people buying anything less than performance cars generally aren't going to be making their purchasing decisions based on horsepower numbers. If power is adequate and delivered smoothly, then the peak HP number is nothing but an advertising gimmick that likely adversely affects fuel economy -- something many consumers DO base their purchasing decisions on. A torquey 2.0 EB that makes 20 less horsepower than a thirstier V6 will probably sell better in today's market, all else being equal.

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FWIW, Flex broke the hallowed 2,000/mo barrier. :lol:

A lot of 2011 Flex's have been hitting the road here lately. Seen more on the road in the last couple weeks than I have seen since the car debuted.

 

Just FYI, the Phx Metro area encompasses more than 3 million people.

Well, that depends. From my time living down there, in the winter sure 3M was true. But April to Oct, heck half the population go home for summer (snow birds).

 

A fully optioned Escape with all the goodies should be more than a base Edge. The money is in the options and the new styling makes it more appealing to a broader customer base who would be willing to pay a little more.

Wow, but when people claimed the same for a new Ranger creeping into the F-150 price range, they were considered loony and no one would ever buy a Ranger then. Love to see the double standards.

 

It's funny that the same people who won't accept the current Escape as being a very successful product try and argue that vehicles like the MKT are actually the ones that are successful because they make more profit per unit. Sure it's not all about sales numbers, but if I actually had some money to bet I'd be willing to bet that the current Escape selling at over 20,000+ copies a month is making Ford a lot more total money then 400+ MKTs. Go ahead and disagree if you want. The fact is you can raise ATP's, but if sales falter over a few thousand units then you end up with a net loss.

But when it comes to talking about the Explorer, people here love to throw out sales figures, but dismiss sales figures when it doesn't benefit their case, such as talking about GM and Toyota products. I've found the arguments here are all over the board and never consistent. Well they are consistently inconsistent.

 

For the hundredth time you think everyone lives in a city and never drives off the pavement because that is your life experience. There are A LOT of people that use their Escapes as SUVs and take light off road adventures. You want the vehicles lightened up as much as possible because your only concern is MPG. I want decent MPG, but I also want something that is strong enough to pull my snowmobile up to the unloading point and can handle pulling the trailer through a little snow without twisting off the driveshaft. You say none of that matters... make um cheap and charge a lot. I kindly disagree.

It's not worth fighting. Too many here think everyone driving a Ford, or any make/model stay solely on the concrete. You and I must be the only two in the US that go off the beaten path.

 

But it's kind of funny this past winter. Watching the weather channel and the midwest and east coast get hammered by snow storms, people stranded and what not. And those storms weren't half as bad as many of the storms I've experienced on an annual basis. With a truly reliable and capable vehicle, I have yet to get stranded or have the issues many of the car and beaten path people experienced last year.

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It's not worth fighting. Too many here think everyone driving a Ford, or any make/model stay solely on the concrete. You and I must be the only two in the US that go off the beaten path.

 

No, but you are both in the very small minority of people who want to be able to do it in a compact CUV.

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