Sarah Palin

[RaZor]

Your insight Dean - it's almost like you have been the fly on the wall . . .

 

That is exactly (almost verbatim) of what typically happens, sadly.

 

When I worked for a Fortune 500 company in lower upper management, I became very aware (even though I was on the "good" level) that in corporate life, there are at least (a minimum of) two different "classes" of employees (we'll temporarily forget about officers - they are in a different universe altogether). . . and it is instilled in the minds of those in the upper class. Very much like the Indian caste system.

 

The ironic thing about it is that more (and better) cost savings/profit enhancements and suggestions came from the "lower class" (The Shudras in India) .

 

But even on here(BON), there seem to be quite a few that think that those receiving those big checks - deserve them (even if they knew how little they work for them) - and deserve to pay a lower tax rate than they do. Go figure.

 

I guess that the chickens loving Colonel Sanders syndrome is here to stay.

[Deanh]

Your insight Dean - it's almost like you have been the fly on the wall . . .

 

That is exactly (almost verbatim) of what typically happens, sadly.

 

When I worked for a Fortune 500 company in lower upper management, I became very aware (even though I was on the "good" level) that in corporate life, there are at least (a minimum of) two different "classes" of employees (we'll temporarily forget about officers - they are in a different universe altogether). . . and it is instilled in the minds of those in the upper class. Very much like the Indian caste system.

 

The ironic thing about it is that more (and better) cost savings/profit enhancements and suggestions came from the "lower class" (The Shudras in India) .

 

But even on here(BON), there seem to be quite a few that think that those receiving those big checks - deserve them (even if they knew how little they work for them) - and deserve to pay a lower tax rate than they do. Go figure.

 

I guess that the chickens loving Colonel Sanders syndrome is here to stay.

appreciate that, but truly when it comes to politics and issues all I can base my opinions ( and they are MY opinions...I do not doubt others knowledge )on are basically the "Big" picture...my father on the other hand is the opposite, politics to me are absolutely rife with mis-perceptions, deceipt, greed and un-truths, I truly LOVE this country but from an outsiders veiw it seems to me they concentrate more on poking their noses in foreign peoples business rather than concentrating more on their home turf...and now look at the state of affairs....I say fix the house before you venture into someone elses...and therein lies my simplistic approach to a fault, I do NOT in any way or form profess to be politically savvy...but I am also one not to vehemently applaud actions that are directly responsible for the state of todays economy. Iraq was one of the biggest boneheaded moves I have ever EVER seen, WMD my ass.....hmmm, theres one excuse/ lie, unless of course they were stealth. To me Iraq was a diversionary tatic to draw attention away from the Afganistan failure/debaucle....hell finish one job before you start another ,APPARENTLY that needs doing.... ( waste of innocent lives and TRILLIONS of taxpayers $ )next up the housing / mortgage ....add a dash of banks going sour....but be sure to sprinkle a little , as Georgey and McCain have repeatedly stated "The Economy is holding stable....." and there one has it, obviously no-one in the top seats of the country has the ability to multi-task let alone make intelligent decisions....one thing though...bet George is going to LOVE turning this travesty and mess over to some other poor bugger, regardless of who it is....my message.....Fix your own house before you call the Association and complain about your neigbours yard.....so go ahead, some can flame me, no biggie, but I can admit my naiveity ( and bad spelling probably ) but my eyesight is still pretty good....... Edited September 19, 2008 by Deanh

[BlackHorse]

When I worked for a Fortune 500 company in lower upper management, I became very aware (even though I was on the "good" level) that in corporate life, there are at least (a minimum of) two different "classes" of employees (we'll temporarily forget about officers - they are in a different universe altogether). . . and it is instilled in the minds of those in the upper class. Very much like the Indian caste system.

 

Ah, perception of class and class envy. A cornerstone of every liberal agenda. To see a class system even where none exists. You had a job, go to work, do your job. You're not there worry about some percieved social order that doesn't exist. Pecking orders exist in every job be it a Fortune 500 company or Bob's Small Engine repair. That's just the nature of people. If you don't like your job, find a different job. Even the military has rules regarding the way in which officers and enlisted soldiers may interact. What makes you think that corporate America would or should be different? It's just the way of people. Get over it. Quit crying about some silly class system and how it ruined your life oh boo huu.

 

What the heck is "lower upper management" anyway? LOL Is that some line you drop chicks while your hanging out a MacQuires pub in Manhattan. "Hey baby, I'm in lower upper management at fortune 500 company."

 

She's going to laugh and say "What they didn't tell you that's just a nice way of saying middle management?"

Edited September 19, 2008 by BlackHorse

[Len_A]

Ah, perception of class and class envy. A cornerstone of every liberal agenda. To see a class system even where none exists. You had a job, go to work, do your job. You're not there worry about some percieved social order that doesn't exist. Pecking orders exist in every job be it a Fortune 500 company or Bob's Small Engine repair. That's just the nature of people. If you don't like your job, find a different job. Even the military has rules regarding the way in which officers and enlisted soldiers may interact. What makes you think that corporate America would or should be different? It's just the way of people. Get over it. Quit crying about some silly class system and how it ruined your life oh boo huu.

 

What the heck is "lower upper management" anyway? LOL Is that some line you drop chicks while your hanging out a MacQuires pub in Manhattan. "Hey baby, I'm in lower upper management at fortune 500 company."

 

She's going to laugh and say "What they didn't tell you that's just a nice way of saying middle management?"

That's it. Keep being a butt monkey for the wealthy class, and do it with a smile on your face. They might trickle some benefit down to you.

[BlackHorse]

That's it. Keep being a butt monkey for the wealthy class, and do it with a smile on your face. They might trickle some benefit down to you.

 

 

Yeah you're right. A much better idea is to let Barrack Obama act out his robin hood fantasies by taking money from the rich and giving it to the middle class.

 

Oh wait, he's not going to give us anywhere near the amount he takes from them.

 

 

I wonder what will happen to the rest of it?

 

 

Once again, class envy and class hatred, cornerstones of liberal ideolgoy. Always nourish that us vs them mindset. Always encourage the population to define themselves by a social class, a race, a religion. Whatever it is, so long as they are dependent on you, the liberal savior, to be the go between and make everything right, forgetting that you caused the class envy issue to begin with.

Edited September 19, 2008 by BlackHorse

[suv_guy_19]

Yeah you're right. A much better idea is to let Barrack Obama act out his robin hood fantasies by taking money from the rich and giving it to the middle class.

 

Oh wait, he's not going to give us anywhere near the amount he takes from them.

 

 

I wonder what will happen to the rest of it?

 

 

Maybe he'll use it to pay down the Republican created debt. Or to provide the 50 million Americans who don't have healthcare with some type of coverage. Maybe he'll balance the books with it. Maybe he'll put it towards infrastructure.

 

I don't remember who it was but someone once said that they enjoy paying taxes, because they're the price of civilization. Its a truth that you are going to have to live with. Money is going to be needed to fix the problems that have been created.

[Deanh]

Yeah you're right. A much better idea is to let Barrack Obama act out his robin hood fantasies by taking money from the rich and giving it to the middle class.

 

Oh wait, he's not going to give us anywhere near the amount he takes from them.

 

 

I wonder what will happen to the rest of it?

 

 

Once again, class envy and class hatred, cornerstones of liberal ideolgoy. Always nourish that us vs them mindset. Always encourage the population to define themselves by a social class, a race, a religion. Whatever it is, so long as they are dependent on you, the liberal savior, to be the go between and make everything right, forgetting that you caused the class envy issue to begin with.

very presumptuous statemen again BlackHearse......so far it seems you are the one with "class" issues...or perhaps lack of such.....next you will be throwing barbs at someones "presumed" education levels...........ahem! PS...I believe the "r" in Robin...and the "h" in Hood should in fact be capitalised.....could be wrong though.....never was a fan of English....Maori was more my cup of tea...Kiora!

Edited September 19, 2008 by Deanh

[BlackHorse]

very presumptuous statemen again BlackHearse......so far it seems you are the one with "class" issues...or perhaps lack of such.....next you will be throwing barbs at someones "presumed" education levels...........ahem! PS...I beleive the "r" in Robin...and the "h" in Hood should in fact be capitalised.....could be wrong though.....never was a fan of English....Maori was more my cup of tea...Kiora!

 

Well given that I was referring to his robin hood fantasy as an inanimate preoccupation and not the actual person I'm not sure about capitalizing the R or H. Could be wrong though. I guess my only saving grace is that I used all the right letters and didn't leave the "t" off of statement or use an "s" in the word capitalized. You're not up to this Deanh and I'm not coming down there. We're done.

[RaZor]

BlackHorse, apparently you are not privy to large corporate structure. Let's just say, that there is in fact several levels of management. Small companies have typically hourly, lower mgmt (supers), middle mgmt, upper mgmt, and corp officers. Large companies often have several levels of mgmt - esp several years ago, before corps started thinning out the white collar workers (the telltale is what meetings you attended).

 

I left because the corp exec ladder was beginning to get in the way of family - and family comes first for me. You only have a specified number of years when your children are growing up. I didn't want to miss out on those <years>. So I ended going into business for myself and making more than I had in the corp world w/less stress and a whole lot more time to raise my son. . . which became important as I ended up getting divorced (boy did she clean up) but my son chose to live with me when he was of the age when the courts recognized his opinion.

 

Would do it all over again, except I would leave her even sooner if I could get a do-over. I wasted some good years then and it didn't end up negatively affecting my son - as our bond became even tighter <after I left>.

 

As far as the corp class thing - that's just the way it is and it really is more cut and dried than most (esp those close to the lower levels) will ever know. I enjoyed all the benies of being close to the top.

 

Sorry to disappoint or confuse you, the term was just a non-disclosure type privacy thing. I wasn't trying to elevate my position, more like lowering it (hence the use of the term lower). Didn't matter as once they had the idea that they could send me all over the country/world - I had to make a decision, so I did, and I was out of there and was able to coach my son's t-ball and baseball teams (etc).

[BlackHorse]

Maybe he'll use it to pay down the Republican created debt. Or to provide the 50 million Americans who don't have healthcare with some type of coverage. Maybe he'll balance the books with it. Maybe he'll put it towards infrastructure.

 

I don't remember who it was but someone once said that they enjoy paying taxes, because they're the price of civilization. Its a truth that you are going to have to live with. Money is going to be needed to fix the problems that have been created.

 

Now see Deanh, this is how you formulate a rational, logical, coherent response.

 

But nay SUV, you are wrong my friend. They'll waste the money as they have all these years.

[Deanh]

Well given that I was referring to his robin hood fantasy as an inanimate preoccupation and not the actual person I'm not sure about capitalizing the R or H. Could be wrong though. I guess my only saving grace is that I used all the right letters and didn't leave the "t" off of statement or use an "s" in the word capitalized. You're not up to this Deanh and I'm not coming down there. We're done.

well...colour me beet-red....off the pedestal oh holier than thou one.....you seriously need an ego check my friend.....if you base ones opinion on someones spelling and typing prowess, enjoy a table for one at the next NRA picnic....... have a great weekend BlackBeard ( PS, keypad has issues......how bout them apples....along with me being too lazy to check....LOL )

Edited September 19, 2008 by Deanh

[BlackHorse]

I left because the corp exec ladder was beginning to get in the way of family - and family comes first for me. You only have a specified number of years when your children are growing up. I didn't want to miss out on those <years>. So I ended going into business for myself and making more than I had in the corp world w/less stress and a whole lot more time to raise my son.

 

 

I respect and applaud you there, both for putting your family first and for having the guts to be an entreprenuar. Well done.

[suv_guy_19]

Now see Deanh, this is how you formulate a rational, logical, coherent response.

 

But nay SUV, you are wrong my friend. They'll waste the money as they have all these years.

 

 

They might do that too. You know me though, the eternal optimist.

[BlackHorse]

well...colour me beet-red....off the pedestal oh holier than thou one.....you seriously need an ego check my friend.....if you base ones opinion on someones spelling and typing prowess, enjoy a table for one at the next NRA picnic....... have a great weekend BlackBeard ( PS, keypad has issues......how bout them apples....along with me being too lazy to check....LOL )

 

What can I say, my ego flares up and forces me up on my pedestal whenever I get told I'm presumptuous. A false charge I might add. Thanks once again for playing.

 

Oh and blaming the keyboard, tisk, tisk Deanh. A new low.

[Deanh]

I respect and applaud you there, both for putting your family first and for having the guts to be an entreprenuar. Well done.

hey...POT....Kettle here...its.........entreprenEur....crow...meet Blackhorses plate.....honestly though B...enough with the grammar, spelling police....we ALL have our hiccups.....

[Deanh]

What can I say, my ego flares up and forces me up on my pedestal whenever I get told I'm presumptuous. A false charge I might add. Thanks once again for playing.

 

Oh and blaming the keyboard, tisk, tisk Deanh. A new low.

actually true....worst is when I hit the same button twice...sometimes 2nd hit doesn't take....as for my mouse...just want to SMASH that thing sometimes....another part may be the fact i don't care to check, didn't realize it was that important.......

[Deanh]

They might do that too. You know me though, the eternal optimist.

me too...but getting a little tired of feeling constantly let down....can't see it getting much worse though, I have some friends in some pretty dire circumstances.....may have a full house soon....

[BlackHorse]

hey...POT....Kettle here...its.........entreprenEur....crow...meet Blackhorses plate.....honestly though B...enough with the grammar, spelling police....we ALL have our hiccups.....

 

I misspelled it .... .... and I won't even blame my keyboard like some loser.

[Deanh]

I misspelled it .... .... and I won't even blame my keyboard like some loser.

spelling is my fault....missing a letter occasionally is this damn keyboard....welcome back to reality though Blackie....you still need to chill a tad though....seriously, out of here, back to the diatribe monday...and sincerely ( believe it or not ) have a good weekend....and vote for the half White guy.... ( teasing ) Cheers.

[Edstock]

Ah, perception of class and class envy. A cornerstone of every liberal agenda. To see a class system even where none exists.

:hysterical:

 

" To see a class system even where none exists." You want to believe that, why not? My opinion is different, that a class structure exists, and because it's a human construct, is is capable of systemic analysis.

 

To the upper echelon, I am less than the dust beneath the wheels of their golden chariots; you, on the other hand, are considered from their perspective, to be a useful idiot. Yet you are an intelligent person. The Wiki below is rather good.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_class_...e_United_States

 

Dennis Gilbert, William Thompson, Joseph Hickey, and James Henslin have proposed class systems with six distinct social classes. These class models feature an upper or capitalist class consisting of the rich and powerful, an upper middle class consisting of highly educated and well-paid professionals, a lower middle class consisting of college-educated professional sales and office assistance, a working class constituted by clerical as well as blue collar workers whose work is highly routinized, and a lower class divided between the working poor and underclass.

[RangerM]

what 40% pay zero?

is unemployment that high?

or has someone been editing wiki again?

 

I'll repeat my post for you (NOTE: No wikipedia there. The links provided go to taxfoundation.org and ontheissues.org):

 

Per, http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/1410.html, 40% of working families pay NO Federal Income taxes. (average of 22% of Married filing Jointly, 22% of Married filing separately, and 66% of Heads of Household)

 

Somehow BO is going to give a tax cut to 95% of working families, but given that 40% pay NO income taxes, that's quite a trick.

[RangerM]

Nope, but she is a politician, just like ol' Adolf was a politician.

 

You have now demonstrated your inability to reinforce an argument, a tendency to demogogue, and your blatant disregard of historical context.

 

Your opinions in this matter are no longer considered relevant.

[Edstock]

You have now demonstrated your inability to reinforce an argument, a tendency to demogogue, and your blatant disregard of historical context.

 

Your opinions in this matter are no longer considered relevant.

You are entitled to your opinion. Consulting a dictionary would be good, too. I have many tendencies, but "a tendency to demogogue (sic)" isn't one of them. That's for people like Rush Limbaugh, capice?.

 

American Heritage Dictionary - dem·a·gogue also dem·a·gog (děm'ə-gôg', -gŏg') Pronunciation Key

n.

1. A leader who obtains power by means of impassioned appeals to the emotions and prejudices of the populace.

2. A leader of the common people in ancient times.

 

You talk of historical context.

 

Let's take Hitler, for example. You rankle at the suggestion that he was a politician, yet that's what he was. Hitler got elected first, then made himself dictator. As an elected politician and leader of the Nazi party, he resorted to demagoguery, appealing to a population that was very nervous and insecure about the future, having survived the Weimar inflation and threat of civil war. And thus a small political movement gathered momentum.

 

So, compare to the hatred and fear spread by the Republicans.

 

 

http://www.oldamericancentury.org/image_ga...ge_gallery1.htm

[RangerM]

You are entitled to your opinion. Consulting a dictionary would be good, too. I have many tendencies, but "a tendency to demogogue (sic)" isn't one of them. That's for people like Rush Limbaugh, capice?.

 

American Heritage Dictionary - dem·a·gogue also dem·a·gog (děm'ə-gôg', -gŏg') Pronunciation Key

n.

1. A leader who obtains power by means of impassioned appeals to the emotions and prejudices of the populace.

2. A leader of the common people in ancient times.

 

Nice try.

 

Mirriam-Webster's Dictionary (cut and paste the link): "http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/demagogue[2]"

 

Main Entry: demagogue

Variant(s): also demagog

Function: verb

Inflected Form(s): demagogued also demagoged; demagogu·ing also demagog·ing

Date: 1656

intransitive verb

: to behave like a demagogue

transitive verb

: to treat (as an issue) in a demagogic manner

Edited September 20, 2008 by RangerM

[Edstock]

Nice try.

Why, thank-you. As you see, your definition has no explanation of the meaning of the word:

 

: to behave like a demagogue

transitive verb

: to treat (as an issue) in a demagogic manner

 

But as you see, my dictionary reference actually explains the meaning of the word:

 

A leader who obtains power by means of impassioned appeals to the emotions and prejudices of the populace

 

Now, it is probably more accurate to say that while I have not engaged in demagoguery, but provocation, what I have posted has certainly pushed your buttons. Thus, it was not an "an impassioned appeal" to your "emotions and prejudices", but an intentional statement that there are "emotions and prejudices" that are dangerous to liberty.

 

The Palin illustration upsets people; it upsets you.

 

The artist is a young woman who doesn't trust Palin, and pointed out that Palin, as a demagog, presents danger to freedom of choice. Add in McCain's fixation on non-existant fetus farms*, and as a woman, she may have good reason to feel the way she does, especially given the GOP's attitude to Roe vs. Wade.

 

Use the web, go to the artist's site and tell her what you think.

 

* http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/09...n-skews-sc.html

Edited September 20, 2008 by Edstock