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Customer Complaint


kmitch

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I guess based on the title of this topic, you can tell I'm not terribly happy with Ford. I sent a letter back on July 26th outlining my issues (I've removed with X's some of the text to protect the innocent):

 

Ford Motor Company

Customer Relationship Center

P.O. Box 6248

Dearborn, MI 48121

 

To Whom It May Concern:

 

I ordered a 2009 Mustang GT California Special from XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX in Roanoke, Virginia on April 24, 2008. The sales cycle was not without incident, but the dealership’s sales and service staff worked diligently to remedy each situation they were presented with, and should be commended.

 

When I ordered the vehicle, I also made arrangements for the installation of the following items by the dealer prior to my taking delivery of the vehicle to make it my own:

 

Part Number Description

401346 Roush Quarter Window Louver Kit

5220 Edelbrock Adjustable Pan Hard Bar

M-5230-GTA 2005-08 Mustang GT Muffler Set

5.81260K Eibach Camber Bolts

M-2005-FR3 2005-08 Mustang GT Coupe Handling Pack

8R3Z-16A200-A Strut Tower Brace

7R3Z-16A550-AA GT500 Mud Flap (Rear) Right Side

7R3Z-16A550-AB GT500 Mud Flap (Rear) Left Side

4L3Z-17700-B Mirror, Auto-Dimming Compass.Homelink. With Temp. Display.

5L8Z-7804810-AAA Ash Cup/Coin Holder

 

The vehicle arrived at the dealer on June 26, 2008. All of the issues were remedied, and I was able to take delivery on July 11th with 28 miles on it.

 

All was well until July 17, 2008. The car had been in my garage in the morning, I got in to drive it back to work after lunch, and the check engine light came on at 319.9 miles. I contacted the dealership and took it in the morning of July 18th. I was told that the code was the Driver’s Side Cam Sensor. They said this may be related to a faulty alternator, cleared the code, and asked me to drive it over the weekend to see if the code came back. Regardless, they wanted me to bring it back in on Monday July 21, 2008.

 

The check engine light had not returned. They tested the alternator, and it did fail the test, and was replaced. I received the car around 5:00 PM on Tuesday, July 22, 2008 with 453 miles.

 

I drove it a little on Tuesday when I got it back, it was parked on Wednesday, and I drove it to work on Thursday, the 24th. When I got in it at 5:00 PM, the check engine light was back. I called the dealership and told them I was bringing it in. When I got there, they scanned it to see what code was reported. The code was slightly different than the original code, but was still related to the same sensor (driver’s side cam). I left the car for them to correct the issue.

 

I normally keep cars for a long time, and take very good care of them. My current daily driver is a 1997 Ford Explorer I ordered. I am having concerns with the longevity and reliability of this Mustang. Given the short time I have had it (roughly 2 weeks), and the amount of time it has been out of my possession for service (4 days), it doesn’t bode well.

 

To complicate matters additionally, I had planned a trip (involving event tickets and hotel reservations) to visit a friend for his Birthday beginning on Friday, July 25th. This would have been the first opportunity to take a road trip in the Mustang, enjoy it, and show it off to my friends. In the end, I was unable to do that.

 

As stated above, I am quickly losing confidence in the car, it’s reliability, and it’s longevity. This has also somewhat tarnished Ford’s reputation in my mind. No one expects a new car with less than 320 miles on it to have issues. I sincerely hope that a remedy for the issues is found.

 

The VIN number of the vehicle is XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX.

 

The favor of a response is requested.

 

I got a call from "Trevor" today, evidently my issue was pushed to the Regional group. He hadn't read the letter, just looked at the summation of the first tier's notes. I was on the phone with him for about 15 minutes, and here's what I got out of the conversation:

 

1. There's nothing they can do unless I have another issue with the vehicle

2. I can't get a response from them in writing

 

My only recourse is to put it out there... No more check engine lights in the last 150 miles, but I still have concerns about the reliability and longevity of the vehicle, considering there were 2 bad components on the vehicle with less that 320 miles (Alternator and cam position sensor).

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So let me get this straight:

 

You had two problems with your car, both of which the dealer quickly fixed free of charge and without any hassle from the dealer whatsoever, and the car has been trouble-free since you got it back the 2nd time.

 

Okay.

 

New vehicles have problems sometimes. It's a fact of life. That's why they come with warranties. You got your problems corrected quickly and it would seem effectively so far.

 

Where's the problem here?

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So let me get this straight:

 

You had two problems with your car, both of which the dealer quickly fixed free of charge and without any hassle from the dealer whatsoever, and the car has been trouble-free since you got it back the 2nd time.

 

Okay.

 

New vehicles have problems sometimes. It's a fact of life. That's why they come with warranties. You got your problems corrected quickly and it would seem effectively so far.

 

Where's the problem here?

 

I'm sorry, but I don't know anyone that would expect a new vehicle to have issues. I could almost understand it if I were buying a vehicle on a new platform like a 2010 Camaro... but these components have been around on vehicles since 2005 (or at leats the changes in 2007). I could also give a little leeway if it were only one of the components that failed (alternator or cam sensor), but to have 2 components fail at the 320 mile mark means to me that Ford, or it's suppliers have some Quality Control issues.

 

Here are the things I didn't expect I'd have to go through with a new car:

1. At 320 miles, I wouldn't expect parts to fail. Quality control at the part manufacturer should have caught both faulty items (snsor and alternator)

2. If quality control let those 2 items slip through, my concern is what other items may be lurking, but the failure isn't apparent until after the warranty is up. I would expect most of the components of a vehicle to last well beyond the warranty period. For example, my 1997 Ford Explorer's A/C failed after warranty due to a poor design (the cannister was wrapped in insulation that allowed condensation to build up between the insulation and metal, causing the metal to corrode), the Ford OEM replacement didn't have that insualtion.

3. Out of the first 18 days, I was without the vehicle for 8 days.

4. I had to arrange for rides on 6 different occasions (to/from picking up the car), this was more than an inconvenience.

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I'm sorry, but I don't know anyone that would expect a new vehicle to have issues. I could almost understand it if I were buying a vehicle on a new platform like a 2010 Camaro... but these components have been around on vehicles since 2005 (or at leats the changes in 2007). I could also give a little leeway if it were only one of the components that failed (alternator or cam sensor), but to have 2 components fail at the 320 mile mark means to me that Ford, or it's suppliers have some Quality Control issues.

 

Here are the things I didn't expect I'd have to go through with a new car:

1. At 320 miles, I wouldn't expect parts to fail. Quality control at the part manufacturer should have caught both faulty items (snsor and alternator)

2. If quality control let those 2 items slip through, my concern is what other items may be lurking, but the failure isn't apparent until after the warranty is up. I would expect most of the components of a vehicle to last well beyond the warranty period. For example, my 1997 Ford Explorer's A/C failed after warranty due to a poor design (the cannister was wrapped in insulation that allowed condensation to build up between the insulation and metal, causing the metal to corrode), the Ford OEM replacement didn't have that insualtion.

3. Out of the first 18 days, I was without the vehicle for 8 days.

4. I had to arrange for rides on 6 different occasions (to/from picking up the car), this was more than an inconvenience.

 

It's entirely possible (and probable) that you had one problem that was misdiagnosed the first time - or that one problem caused the other. It's doubtful you had 2 separate and unrelated problems.

 

If new machines never had problems then we wouldn't need warranties. The point is that having one or even two problems early is not indicative of long term problems. These are either one-off problems that never return or they're due to a batch of bad parts that, once identified and replaced with a good part - don't reoccur.

 

If you continue to have problems, then you can start to worry. Until then, enjoy the ride.

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It's entirely possible (and probable) that you had one problem that was misdiagnosed the first time - or that one problem caused the other. It's doubtful you had 2 separate and unrelated problems.

 

If new machines never had problems then we wouldn't need warranties. The point is that having one or even two problems early is not indicative of long term problems. These are either one-off problems that never return or they're due to a batch of bad parts that, once identified and replaced with a good part - don't reoccur.

 

If you continue to have problems, then you can start to worry. Until then, enjoy the ride.

 

They initially thought that the sensor issue was an alternator problem. Ford provided 3 waveforms for them to compare the output of the alternator to. The Alternator was charging, but the power that it was putting out didn't match any of those wave forms (it was noisy, and could interfere with sensors, etc.)... so this was a bad part.

 

The sensor still threw a code, so they switched driver's and passenger's sensors, and the sensor threw the code on the other side. Bad sensor... 2 bad parts.

 

My other concern is reliability... I bought this car to take road trips, and show off... I don't want to take a trip and be stuck somewhere with a check engine light... I'm a little afraid of that at the moment...

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To complicate matters additionally, I had planned a trip (involving event tickets and hotel reservations) to visit a friend for his Birthday beginning on Friday, July 25th. This would have been the first opportunity to take a road trip in the Mustang, enjoy it, and show it off to my friends. In the end, I was unable to do that.

 

As stated above, I am quickly losing confidence in the car, it’s reliability, and it’s longevity. This has also somewhat tarnished Ford’s reputation in my mind. No one expects a new car with less than 320 miles on it to have issues. I sincerely hope that a remedy for the issues is found.

 

Mister, you have any idea exactly HOW MANY PARTS are in your car? And you expect each and every one of them to be just perfect for you. Do you actually know that usually if a part is going to fail, it's going to fail very soon at the beginning and not middle way thru it's designed life? You know what, you couldn't afford the car if it had the quality control you demand. PERIOD!

 

Ever seen the warranty work on a Rolls-Royce? You expect that those don't have warranty problems?

 

Now for your quote above, the way "I" read it is that YOU didn't take the trip, because you were paranoid! If their is another reason, it's because YOU didn't write it up, because the way you wrote it, is a sympathy play.

 

Your damn right in your thinking, that I find you a whiner. Tell you what, writing up all those dealer install items to try to impress people, makes you also look like you better bail on this car now, while you are still alive and can get the maximum amount of money back out of it while you can.

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Last time I checked, Check Engine lights didn't disable vehicles.

 

Doesn't disable it, but it's telling me there's an issue... and I think it might do more harm than good to drive the 150 miles back home from a weekend trip.

 

Mister, you have any idea exactly HOW MANY PARTS are in your car? And you expect each and every one of them to be just perfect for you. Do you actually know that usually if a part is going to fail, it's going to fail very soon at the beginning and not middle way thru it's designed life? You know what, you couldn't afford the car if it had the quality control you demand. PERIOD!

 

I understand that there are a lot of things that could go wrong... but I've never made a purchase with the expectation that something will go wrong.

 

Now for your quote above, the way "I" read it is that YOU didn't take the trip, because you were paranoid! If their is another reason, it's because YOU didn't write it up, because the way you wrote it, is a sympathy play.

 

I believe you're referring to this part of the letter:

To complicate matters additionally, I had planned a trip (involving event tickets and hotel reservations) to visit a friend for his Birthday beginning on Friday, July 25th. This would have been the first opportunity to take a road trip in the Mustang, enjoy it, and show it off to my friends. In the end, I was unable to do that.

 

I never said I didn't take the trip... only that I couldn't take the trip in the Mustang.

 

Your damn right in your thinking, that I find you a whiner. Tell you what, writing up all those dealer install items to try to impress people, makes you also look like you better bail on this car now, while you are still alive and can get the maximum amount of money back out of it while you can.

 

This was a letter to Ford, I wanted to be up front with them about what had been done to it after it left the factory. I also wanted to be clear that none of those modifications were related to the cam sensor or alternator issue. My intent wasn't to try to impress anyone by documenting those items.

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Mister, you have any idea exactly HOW MANY PARTS are in your car? And you expect each and every one of them to be just perfect for you. Do you actually know that usually if a part is going to fail, it's going to fail very soon at the beginning and not middle way thru it's designed life? You know what, you couldn't afford the car if it had the quality control you demand. PERIOD!

 

Ever seen the warranty work on a Rolls-Royce? You expect that those don't have warranty problems?

 

Now for your quote above, the way "I" read it is that YOU didn't take the trip, because you were paranoid! If their is another reason, it's because YOU didn't write it up, because the way you wrote it, is a sympathy play.

 

Your damn right in your thinking, that I find you a whiner. Tell you what, writing up all those dealer install items to try to impress people, makes you also look like you better bail on this car now, while you are still alive and can get the maximum amount of money back out of it while you can.

 

What the f@$&, he has every right to feel unsure at this point, these problems due occur from time to time, the car is brand new. How would you feel! Chances are they wont re-appear, but you are bashing a loyal customer for his right to be a little concerned, I'm sure after a few weeks he will feel different, but it's people with your mind set that push future customers elsewhere, man use your head :banghead: . A little constructive criticism goes a long way, but DAMN :tequila:

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What the f@$&, he has every right to feel unsure at this point, these problems due occur from time to time, the car is brand new. How would you feel! Chances are they wont re-appear, but you are bashing a loyal customer for his right to be a little concerned, I'm sure after a few weeks he will feel different, but it's people with your mind set that push future customers elsewhere, man use your head :banghead: . A little constructive criticism goes a long way, but DAMN :tequila:

 

Naw it's the internet, it's a place to whine,, Don't take any responcibility for your actions,, always look for a reason to blame it elsewhere..

 

Man standing on a corner telling me this story, I'd tell him more than just a sugar coated reply, .. BUCK it up, suck it in, be a friggen man and use your head.. scared to take a trip? LOL, ok..

 

NEXT!

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Naw it's the internet, it's a place to whine,, Don't take any responcibility for your actions,, always look for a reason to blame it elsewhere..

 

Man standing on a corner telling me this story, I'd tell him more than just a sugar coated reply, .. BUCK it up, suck it in, be a friggen man and use your head.. scared to take a trip? LOL, ok..

 

NEXT!

Like I said :tequila: It will kill your pain. :hysterical:

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Naw it's the internet, it's a place to whine,, Don't take any responcibility for your actions,, always look for a reason to blame it elsewhere..

 

Man standing on a corner telling me this story, I'd tell him more than just a sugar coated reply, .. BUCK it up, suck it in, be a friggen man and use your head.. scared to take a trip? LOL, ok..

 

NEXT!

 

After re-reading all of the posts... I don't see where I'm whining... just expressing my concerns about the reliabilty and longevity of the vehicle. If you were in my situation, just bought a new car, in for service 3 times for 2 issues, what would your honest response be?

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After re-reading all of the posts... I don't see where I'm whining... just expressing my concerns about the reliabilty and longevity of the vehicle. If you were in my situation, just bought a new car, in for service 3 times for 2 issues, what would your honest response be?

I can answer that for him.... :tequila:

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After re-reading all of the posts... I don't see where I'm whining... just expressing my concerns about the reliabilty and longevity of the vehicle. If you were in my situation, just bought a new car, in for service 3 times for 2 issues, what would your honest response be?

My honest response? I'm probably 95% sure, you GOT a loaner when it was kept over night. Neglected to mention that. You act like this has never happened before. Their isn't one car in 35 years of me purchasing them NEW that it hasn't had one problem or another. I'll tell you my response. I bought a friggen Lincoln, probably paid more than you, it went in for the same problem 4 times and has been OUT of service for a total of 5 months in less than 9 months of ownership. SHIT happens.

 

SHIT happen dude. it happens to you it happens to everyone, but then again, it wasn't suppose to do that to you.

 

oh yea.. you whined that you couldn't take your trip to model your new car.. DUDE, you make it sound like it was a car problem. you wrote it was OK, but you was skeered. Nice way to Avoid answering. Christ, loved how you noted the exact tenth of a mile, while you were driving when the problem occurred. you must be totally anal. Their really are people out there like you, thanks for confirming it, no wonder customer service has to deal with people like this everyday.

 

 

 

You got the correct answer back from Ford, but just to let the world know that it wasn't acceptable to you, you threw the comment unto the net. Glad it got here, real people need to make you see that shit happens to the best of them. BUT neither of those parts were made by Ford.

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My honest response? I'm probably 95% sure, you GOT a loaner when it was kept over night. Neglected to mention that. You act like this has never happened before.

 

Nope, no loaner any of the 3 times it was in for service.

 

Their isn't one car in 35 years of me purchasing them NEW that it hasn't had one problem or another. I'll tell you my response. I bought a friggen Lincoln, probably paid more than you, it went in for the same problem 4 times and has been OUT of service for a total of 5 months in less than 9 months of ownership. SHIT happens.

 

SHIT happen dude. it happens to you it happens to everyone, but then again, it wasn't suppose to do that to you.

 

I guess I've been spoiled by my prior vehicles... they set the expectation too high. :o

 

 

 

oh yea.. you whined that you couldn't take your trip to model your new car.. DUDE, you make it sound like it was a car problem. you wrote it was OK, but you was skeered. Nice way to Avoid answering.

 

The whole trip thing was because the car was in the shop that weekend... left it with them on Thursday, got it back Tuesday... left on my trip on Friday. I've got another trip planned in the Mustang next weekend. Never said I was scared... said I had concerns about the reliability, that's 2 very different things.

 

Christ, loved how you noted the exact tenth of a mile, while you were driving when the problem occurred. you must be totally anal. Their really are people out there like you, thanks for confirming it, no wonder customer service has to deal with people like this everyday.

 

I didn't note it, the Service Manager told me when they pulled the first code... I deal with numbers all day, so it just stuck with me.

 

You got the correct answer back from Ford, but just to let the world know that it wasn't acceptable to you, you threw the comment unto the net. Glad it got here, real people need to make you see that shit happens to the best of them. BUT neither of those parts were made by Ford.

 

I appreciate your candor, and yes I wasn't satisfied with Ford's answer... so I figured I'd leave it up to others to come to their own conclusions. I don't plan on lowering my standards or expectations. After all, I bought a Ford (Ford. Designed for living. Engineered to last.; Quality is Job One; and all that). :D

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My honest response? I'm probably 95% sure, you GOT a loaner when it was kept over night. Neglected to mention that. You act like this has never happened before. Their isn't one car in 35 years of me purchasing them NEW that it hasn't had one problem or another. I'll tell you my response. I bought a friggen Lincoln, probably paid more than you, it went in for the same problem 4 times and has been OUT of service for a total of 5 months in less than 9 months of ownership. SHIT happens.

 

SHIT happen dude. it happens to you it happens to everyone, but then again, it wasn't suppose to do that to you.

 

oh yea.. you whined that you couldn't take your trip to model your new car.. DUDE, you make it sound like it was a car problem. you wrote it was OK, but you was skeered. Nice way to Avoid answering. Christ, loved how you noted the exact tenth of a mile, while you were driving when the problem occurred. you must be totally anal. Their really are people out there like you, thanks for confirming it, no wonder customer service has to deal with people like this everyday.

 

 

 

You got the correct answer back from Ford, but just to let the world know that it wasn't acceptable to you, you threw the comment unto the net. Glad it got here, real people need to make you see that shit happens to the best of them. BUT neither of those parts were made by Ford.

:ninja: I'm out. :drool:

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I feel for your frustrations, but I see it as something that happens sometime. From all my vehicles that I've owned, there's too many to list. Here's a few good ones, though, in reverse chronological order:

 

- 08 Focus SE (the one I just got) -- the driver's side mirror is vibrating quite a bit (almost like riding my Harley) and will be replaced; and the scre in the fuel filler opening is rusting (will get that replaced and either painted or clearcoated where the screwdriver scrapes the finish)

 

- 08 Mustang -- oil leak from oil pan gasket within the first 200 miles; messed-up finish in spots from the dealer letting bird shit sit too long (will never again buy from dealer stock unless just arrived or I order from factory)

 

- 08 Focus SES -- spoiler was nicked during transport process

 

- 07 Mariner -- rotors were warped within the first 1,000 miles

 

- 05 Cavalier -- just to show it's not just Ford -- carpet was not properly installed when they mounted the driver seat

 

- 03 Mustang GT -- washer fluid reservoir cracked for the second time now (seems to occur every 2-3 years)

 

- 98 Mystique -- shorts in electrical system

 

- 97 Corolla -- yes, a Toyota -- faulty air bag switch/sensor recall

 

- 95 Mystique -- "check engine" light kept coming on from the O2 sensors faulting

 

- 87 Cavalier -- "check engine" light kept coming on from O2 sensors faulting; all digital instrumentation went black within the first 300 miles during a night-time drive in rural area; transmission shift linkage shot prematurely

 

Whew! That's just some memorable ones. :stats:

 

My dad also had Town Cars that kept flashing the "check engine" light from O2 sensors and catalytic converters. He kept driving it around for a long time with the light on and didn't have any problems.

 

Again, things happen even to new brand new cars. However, that's what warranties (and extended warranties) are for. I just deal with it has it happens. :hysterical:

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Add to the list:

 

In the first couple thousand miles I had my Cobra, the cruise control stopped working and a synchro went out in the transmission. They were both happily repaired under warranty. Was it an inconvenience? Sure. Did it make me lose faith in the quality of the car? No.

 

Here it is now, 101,000 miles later and it miraculously hasn't self-destructed. It's amazing!!!

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Whilst I appreciate that you're not completely happy with your car as someone else has already stated - that's why vehicles come with warranties, not guarantees.

As has also been said a new component on a brand new car is more likely to fail than one that's been working happily for several years.

 

I've been in the motor trade for nearly 20 years and have seen MUCH worse than you've experienced. To give you an idea look up reliability issues for TVR. I ran a dealship for these for six years.

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Whilst I appreciate that you're not completely happy with your car as someone else has already stated - that's why vehicles come with warranties, not guarantees.

As has also been said a new component on a brand new car is more likely to fail than one that's been working happily for several years.

 

I've been in the motor trade for nearly 20 years and have seen MUCH worse than you've experienced. To give you an idea look up reliability issues for TVR. I ran a dealship for these for six years.

 

Boy, getting a TVR serviced had to have been an absolute picnic! :banghead:

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but I still have concerns about the reliability and longevity of the vehicle, considering there were 2 bad components on the vehicle with less that 320 miles (Alternator and cam position sensor).

 

 

If you are so concerned about reliability and longevity, why did you mod the car before you ever drove it 1 mile?

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If you are so concerned about reliability and longevity, why did you mod the car before you ever drove it 1 mile?

 

I wasn't concerned prior to purchasing the car. Only after having these issues come up did those concerns seem warranted. The items from FRPP are covered under the full vehicle warranty if installed prior to delivery. The labor for the other items was cheaper if bundled in with the rest of the work the dealer was performing. The paint was easier for them to match at that time as well.

 

As has been said by others, those two issues may be it... if so, compared to some of the other stories, I may count myself lucky. Time will tell.

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