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Supreme Court Strikes Down D.C. Gun Ban, Upholds Individual Right to Keep and Bear Arms


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Perhaps they do, but changing laws can't fix everything and allowing large sections of the population to be armed with easily concealed weapons only makes things worse.

Only easier for the criminals that is.

 

Like I said, tell that to Vermont, I believe the state with the least of any crimes and the most lax gun laws.

 

P.S. That is more than my opinion also, look it up, those are the FACTS.

Edited by fmccap
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Again.

 

Gun laws do not keep guns out of the hands of criminals. In fact, they guarentee the only people who HAVE guns are criminals, leaving the law-abiding citizens unarmed.

 

I'll repeat.

 

With lax gun laws, criminals have guns, and so do law-abiding citizens.

 

With strict gun laws, criminals have guns, and law-abiding citizens do not.

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"Personal defense - I feel that no one should be allowed to carry guns on their person outside of the police."

 

Yes very good, and now you will give up your car and only ride mass transit because only the important political leaders of the country need cars for "safety" You will live in a 600 sqft box on the 80th floor of a basement and will work at the factory making pens for the political leaders to enforce more "saftey" laws at $20 but the tax rate is 55%.

 

And to Igor your "guns out of control" comment, no its out of control people with guns! Guns do not kill people, people kill people. Just like the drunk driver killed the family on a sidewalk not the car he was driving.

Edited by 01FOCI
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Long guns can provide protection just as well. If your cities are that unsafe then perhaps you need a big change.

 

 

Well you need a big change in Toronto then because violent crime is up up and away there thanks to this silly notion that law abiding citizens don't need handguns. I guess everyone in Toronto should be walking down the street with their long guns. But oh wait, you'd probably get arrested for that.

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Home defense - Handgun not needed. That's what security systems and other measures are for. If your that worried, get the right equipment to keep your house safe.

 

Personal defense - I feel that no one should be allowed to carry guns on their person outside of the police.

 

I don't expect the police to be everywhere, however some states in the US are too free with their gun laws. Illegal guns flood both my country and yours because of it. I'm not saying that law abididng people can't own guns, but hand guns have no place in cities and people should need to be cleared to own other types of guns. There are states where that isn't the case and others suffer because of it.

 

I like you suv, so don't take this the wrong way. On this issue you are just flat out 100% dyed in the wool, no doubt about it wrong. The above statements in fact border on moronic.

 

Security systems for home defense? Are you serious? LMAO You think the criminals don't know that by the time the police arrive because your alarm has gone off that they will have had more than enough time to do what they came to do and leave?

 

 

No one should be allowed to carry guns on their person outside of the police? Why? First off that's called a police state and we don't live in a police state, we live a free state. Secondly, take a look at what you just wrote. ONLY the police. By virtue of that statement you are admitting that for some reason the police need a firearm. If only the police are carrrying them, why would they need them? Because obviously not only the police are carrying them. You know this even if you don't want to admit it. That no matter what happens, this utopian gun free society that you envision will never come about. That the best laid anti-gun laws around will not prevent criminals from getting guns. Therefore the police must also have guns. That just leaves all the rest of us at the mercy of the criminals and like I said, a police officer is very unlikely to be around when some thug is threatening your life or your loved ones or some other innocent person. Thank you, you just made the case for me as to why private citizens should be allowed to KEEP AND BEAR ARMS.

Edited by BlackHorse
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Yeah, that's right, go ahead and perpetuate the myth that criminals get guns because of lax gun laws. Because dirtbags steal them from people like me, and then ship them to your country (maybe your country ought to tighten up its borders a bit instead of blaming the US for yet another of your ills???). And if you have this massive influx of illegal guns, despite so many restrictions, what does that tell you about the effectiveness of your laws??

 

 

The reason that guns are brought into Canada from the US is because there is a big market for them. The government needs police and the police need crime. Therefore the government needs crime. More law means more crime. If there was less crime, we would need fewer police. If I am a bank robber, I will not pull a gun in a bank full of possibly armed customers.

 

Kids in street gangs make home-made zip guns out of metal tubes and rubber bands. You can't stop guns, so you have to learn to live with them. Gun safety and use should be taught in school. To-day, a kid flashing a gun around is considered cool. In my day, he was considered an idiot and would have the privelege taken away. We all had guns, and nobody ever got shot.

 

In Toronto, where handguns are virtually illegal, there are shootings on a daily basis. Ask the mayor of Toronto why that is and he will say that it is the fault of the guns and the US. The majority of shootings in Toronto have to do with rival gangs and the drug trade. Drug dealers get a slap on the wrist. I think that they only arrest the new ones who are trespassing on the turf of the established ones. The whole narcotics division of the police force depends on the drug trade. If they wipe it out, they lose their jobs. If citizens carry guns, there will be less work for the police, as there will be less crime. Therefore the police are in favor of stricter gun laws. They need crime to make money.

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Finally ladies and gentlemen, let us cover the ultimate reason that the founding fathers of this nation were so intent on private citizens keeping arms. That reason is so that in the event our government becomes so tyrannical that it is an oppressive force upon the population, laden with fools who don't believe we should have the right as individuals to proctect ourselves then somethnig can be done about that government. At that point it becomes the duty of every American to remove that government and begin again. That may seem harsh, but rest assured it is the reason that our founding fathers wanted the 2nd Amendment. Let up hope it never comes to that, but also, let us not forget it.

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Perhaps they do, but changing laws can't fix everything and allowing large sections of the population to be armed with easily concealed weapons only makes things worse.

 

 

Completely untrue. Another anti-gun falsehood. In point of fact studies show that when large segments of the population are known to carry concealed weapons that violent crime decreases dramaticaly.

 

Criminals aren't stupid you know. If they figure there's a good chance they'll get shot, they aren't going to mess around.

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American bandits come to Toronto to do hold-ups because it is easy pickings. Store the gun in a locker at the bus terminal until next time and go home with the loot. The mayor loves it because it gives him more ammunition to go after free-lance gun dealers. The big dealers run the show.

Edited by Trimdingman
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Well you need a big change in Toronto then because violent crime is up up and away there thanks to this silly notion that law abiding citizens don't need handguns. I guess everyone in Toronto should be walking down the street with their long guns. But oh wait, you'd probably get arrested for that.

 

 

You would get arrested for that, because no one should be carrying guns around....and any guess where the Toronto guns are coming from...I'll give you a hint, its south. Toronto, as much as Crime has gone up, has about 1/10th the murder rater per capita of large American cities. its far over exaggerated.

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I like you suv, so don't take this the wrong way. On this issue you are just flat out 100% dyed in the wool, no doubt about it wrong. The above statements in fact border on moronic.

 

Security systems for home defense? Are you serious? LMAO You think the criminals don't know that by the time the police arrive because your alarm has gone off that they will have had more than enough time to do what they came to do and leave?

 

 

No one should be allowed to carry guns on their person outside of the police? Why? First off that's called a police state and we don't live in a police state, we live a free state. Secondly, take a look at what you just wrote. ONLY the police. By virtue of that statement you are admitting that for some reason the police need a firearm. If only the police are carrrying them, why would they need them? Because obviously not only the police are carrying them. You know this even if you don't want to admit it. That no matter what happens, this utopian gun free society that you envision will never come about. That the best laid anti-gun laws around will not prevent criminals from getting guns. Therefore the police must also have guns. That just leaves all the rest of us at the mercy of the criminals and like I said, a police officer is very unlikely to be around when some thug is threatening your life or your loved ones or some other innocent person. Thank you, you just made the case for me as to why private citizens should be allowed to KEEP AND BEAR ARMS.

 

Well, I suppose this is where we differ. I don't believe in taking guns away from most people, but the guns need to come off the street and it has to start somewhere. Living in a place where the only thing keeping the criminals at bey is the citizens carrying guns is not for me. The gun laws in many states need to be tightened. There are states where you can walk up and buy a gun with almost nothing. If you are going to allow people to carry guns then you should be making sure that they can. Training courses, registrations including ballistics, licensing, random background checks. The criminals are getting them somewhere, and many of the somewheres are legitimate gun stores.

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You would get arrested for that, because no one should be carrying guns around....and any guess where the Toronto guns are coming from...I'll give you a hint, its south. Toronto, as much as Crime has gone up, has about 1/10th the murder rater per capita of large American cities. its far over exaggerated.

 

It is not guns that shoot people. It is the people using them. The people using guns in Toronto are criminals and they know that you are unarmed. If your home is invaded by some maniac with a gun, you are as good as dead if you are depending on the police to save you. They are not going to put themselves at risk against an armed suspect. They will surround the house and speak to the suspect from a safe distance. Your only chance is to take the criminal out yourself. If the maniac knows that you are armed, he will probably stay out of your house. Ninety per cent of the time, you will be removed from the house in a body bag in Toronto.

Edited by Trimdingman
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It is not guns that shoot people. It is the people using them. The people using guns in Toronto are criminals and they know that you are unarmed. If your home is invaded by some maniac with a gun, you are as good as dead if you are depending on the police to save you. They are not going to put themselves at risk against an armed suspect. They will surround the house and speak to the suspect from a safe distance. Your only chance is to take the criminal out yourself. If the maniac knows that you are armed, he will probably stay out of your house. Ninety per cent of the time, you will be removed from the house in a body bag in Toronto.

 

 

Oh, thats so full of bull. Millions of Canadians have guns, so the criminals don't know who has them here either. Toronto isn't near as bad as people make out, it actually has an incredibly low murder rate for its size.

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Anyway, I said I didn't want to argue and I won't. You guys like guns, good, I happen not to. If people want to have them, fine, don't take them away. I still don't see a reason for carry or for handguns in cities but that's just me. Even if I was in government I wouldn't take peoples guns away, but there would have to be changes to some things, such as the addition of random background checks.

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You would get arrested for that, because no one should be carrying guns around....and any guess where the Toronto guns are coming from...I'll give you a hint, its south. Toronto, as much as Crime has gone up, has about 1/10th the murder rater per capita of large American cities. its far over exaggerated.

 

I carry a gun around, every day, all the time, becuase you just never know what might happen. The day my government tells me I can't carry a gun around, that's the day I tell my government to get lost and I would be obliged to do so.

 

 

As for where the guns in Toronto are coming form, it's irrelavent suv. If they didn't get them from the US they would get them from somewhere.

 

As far as the violent crime rate in Toronto as compared to most US cities the fact is you have no idea what the real numbers are because there is no official data and even if there was some report it would be subject to question because governments that have strict gun laws that are failing dont like to admit it so they often don't release all the data to reveal the whole picture.

 

As of 2005 the US wasn't even in the top 5 most dangerous of the worlds developed countires. It's

 

5. Russia

4. Venezuela

3. Jamaica

2. South Africa

1. Columbia

 

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1...ge=2&cat=16

 

All countries with strict gun laws.

 

 

Gun control is an abject failure, no matter how much you may not want to admit it suv. Case closed.

Edited by BlackHorse
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As far as the violent crime rate in Toronto as compared to most US cities the fact is you have no idea what the real numbers are because there is no official data and even if there was some report it would be subject to question because governments that have strict gun laws that are failing dont like to admit it so they often to release all the data to reveal the whole picture.

 

Last year, Toronto had something around 65 murders. Philadelphia had an average of one per day, and from what I've heard, is one of the better cities. Also, many of those countries you listed are not first world.

 

Actually, I don't think any of them are.

Edited by suv_guy_19
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Oh, and Quebec, the place with the harshest laws, well the Capital had o murders lat year, and one the year before that. A city of 700000. I have nothing against the US, bu there are other ways to do things and what we are doing seems to be working. Crime overall is down as it is in the US. Again, I just consider myself lucky to live where I do.

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Last year, Toronto had something around 65 murders. Philadelphia had an average of one per day, and from what I've heard, is one of the better cities. Also, many of those countries you listed are not first world.

 

Actually, I don't think any of them are.

 

It was 84 last year not 65.

 

As for first second or third world countries as it relates to violence. It has absolutely no bearing.

 

China is a second world nation but I don't think anyone would deny their impact on first world economies would they?

 

Saudi Arabia is ranked as a third world nation but their violent crime rate makes Canada look like the shoot out at the OK coral.

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I stand corrected.

 

 

Canadians are not violent for the most part. The reason can probably be explained through a study of the demographics of Canadians. We do not have a huge ghetto culture. Most people are here to make money and do business. We have a large immigrant population. People who leave their homes for a chance at a better life do not usually become criminals and they tend to watch their children closely. You cannot attribute Canada's low crime rate to strict gun control. Probably the opposite is true. I would bet on it. Loosen gun laws and the crime rate would be even lower.

Edited by Trimdingman
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