[Furious1Auto]

wescoent, on Jan 2 2008, 02:44 PM, said:

Very interesting.

Strange Ford would go down this road, especially in light of the jacked-up CAFE requirements. A Bronco/Ranger combo would be a great way to share the development costs, but I have to wonder what kind of volume either would sell. If they're too low, they won't pay for their development, and if its too high, they'll kill Ford's CAFE.

Jeep is a losing proposition in its current form. Too many platforms, too poor fuel economy, and too much sharing with Chrysler.

Nothing is confirmed but rather all speculation, these users are just like you and I. I'll tell you one thing with Ford's current position they are not going to buy any part of Chrysler unless it is for pennies on the dollar!

[AlRozzi]

Before Cerberus even makes a move I would expect them to discontinue certain models. Jeep will lose the Liberty and Commander before it will be sold. I don't believe Ford would want Jeep, but if they did, I'd bet Mercury would go away.

[NLPRacing]

groundassault, on Jan 1 2008, 01:59 PM, said:

Ford does need to build the Bronco....and they ARE building it.....it started on a LR Defender chasis and changed to a modified F-150 chasis with a SOLID front axle......they justified this by sharing it with the new F-100 (ranger)........but like my source said, it would be a only a single gen and then share with the wrangler....

Not to mention to the poster who said that chrysler might be sold off......Cerebrus is not dumb, they are worth way more broken up then they are as a full company....Jeep and Dodge by themselves are worth a lot more and chrysler is a brand that a foreign car company can use to get into the US market.....Cerebrus is a professional money machine...they know who wants what and they aren't stuckup like the Germans were when they dumped Chrysler....The indians and the chinese were willing to pay gobs of money and would have probably given too much, but their mouths are watering and will pay any price...this is what Cerebrus knows....

Blue II, on Jan 2 2008, 01:18 PM, said:

Some want the Explorer name on that instead of Bronco, that is if Jeep comes over.

Are you acknowledging what "groundassault" is saying? The next Explorer/Bronco will be a true off roader? Will it have 4 doors?

[groundassault]

Furious1Auto, on Jan 2 2008, 02:55 PM, said:

Nothing is confirmed but rather all speculation, these users are just like you and I. I'll tell you one thing with Ford's current position they are not going to buy any part of Chrysler unless it is for pennies on the dollar!

No I am not like you at all. I have been reading this forum forever and have almost never posted. And the reason Ford wants Jeep is because they are restructuring the brand name FORD. Meaning that if there is a JEEP brand then Ford will not have any "gas guzzling SUV's" as my source put it. Everyone knows what a "JEEP" is in fact better then Land Rover. JEEP has the most recognized grille in the world with 7 slots, round headlights and damn near flat (not to mention as Churchill put it "Jeep won the war). BTW Mulally is still predicting profit from Ford in 09 and Cerebrus will not let them go in less then 5 years (another subject all together).

I have not heard about the Explorer, except that its supposed to be a crossover next?

I am not sure if the Mustang is going to be on the Falcon but I know that 2009/2010 is the last year for the panthers. Those are for sure going on the falcon chasis. But they are not getting any good engines so there will be NO falcon over here.

Ford is also DEBATING the Ranger issue....weather or not we will get the new one before they do a model year of the Brazilian version (4 Door WITH the diesel but otherwise the same). There are a few of those sitting at the DDC as of 12/24. I also have seen one in Brighton around 6/07.

If you guys don't want to believe me thats cool. I am just passing along info....if you think that I am full of potatos then just tell me and I won't post anymore....no big deal.


NLP.....the Bronco is supposed to be like the one at the auto show but toned down.....There will be no four door yet....more like a Wrangler or the new H4. Folding windshield (as of now), removable doors, and removeable top (not above the driver and passenger) like the last bronco.

This post has been edited by groundassault: 02 January 2008 - 06:03 PM

[wescoent]

groundassault, on Jan 2 2008, 06:02 PM, said:

No I am not like you at all. I have been reading this forum forever and have almost never posted. And the reason Ford wants Jeep is because they are restructuring the brand name FORD. Meaning that if there is a JEEP brand then Ford will not have any "gas guzzling SUV's" as my source put it. Everyone knows what a "JEEP" is in fact better then Land Rover. JEEP has the most recognized grille in the world with 7 slots, round headlights and damn near flat (not to mention as Churchill put it "Jeep won the war). BTW Mulally is still predicting profit from Ford in 09 and Cerebrus will not let them go in less then 5 years (another subject all together).

I have not heard about the Explorer, except that its supposed to be a crossover next?

I am not sure if the Mustang is going to be on the Falcon but I know that 2009/2010 is the last year for the panthers. Those are for sure going on the falcon chasis. But they are not getting any good engines so there will be NO falcon over here.

Ford is also DEBATING the Ranger issue....weather or not we will get the new one before they do a model year of the Brazilian version (4 Door WITH the diesel but otherwise the same). There are a few of those sitting at the DDC as of 12/24. I also have seen one in Brighton around 6/07.

If you guys don't want to believe me thats cool. I am just passing along info....if you think that I am full of potatos then just tell me and I won't post anymore....no big deal.
NLP.....the Bronco is supposed to be like the one at the auto show but toned down.....There will be no four door yet....more like a Wrangler or the new H4. Folding windshield (as of now), removable doors, and removeable top (not above the driver and passenger) like the last bronco.

Interesting idea.

This would involve one HELL of a dealership restructuring, given that Jeep dealers are tied to Chrysler. If every Ford dealer automatically got a Jeep franchise, and just sold Explorers as Grand Cherokees. Or maybe a Jeep Explorer? Jeep Expedition? What would happen to the F-Series?

[TStag]

groundassault, on Jan 2 2008, 11:02 PM, said:

No I am not like you at all. I have been reading this forum forever and have almost never posted. And the reason Ford wants Jeep is because they are restructuring the brand name FORD. Meaning that if there is a JEEP brand then Ford will not have any "gas guzzling SUV's" as my source put it. Everyone knows what a "JEEP" is in fact better then Land Rover. JEEP has the most recognized grille in the world with 7 slots, round headlights and damn near flat (not to mention as Churchill put it "Jeep won the war). BTW Mulally is still predicting profit from Ford in 09 and Cerebrus will not let them go in less then 5 years (another subject all together).

Hmm so why have Jeep sales fallen off the side of a cliff in Europe, whilst Land Rover has been booming, whilst in many cases charging twice as much money. In addition why is Jeep loosing sales to Land Rover in it's home market by not producing cars that compete with things like the Range Rover and the Freelander? Also what does Land Rover make that is as awfull as the Compas? In fact does anyone make anything as bad as the compass? But ok, I admit it Land Rover makes nothing like that to compete with it on 3rd world fuel economy....namely because it doesn't make cars in the 3rd world either.

Jeep has well and truly blown it in Europe. BMW and Land Rover have taken the premium market, whilst Kia and Honda have picked up the bottom end. Even in the US they are struggling to match the imports.

[wescoent]

TStag, on Jan 2 2008, 07:10 PM, said:

Hmm so why have Jeep sales fallen off the side of a cliff in Europe, whilst Land Rover has been booming, whilst in many cases charging twice as much money. In addition why is Jeep loosing sales to Land Rover in it's home market by not producing cars that compete with things like the Range Rover and the Freelander? Also what does Land Rover make that is as awfull as the Compas? In fact does anyone make anything as bad as the compass? But ok, I admit it Land Rover makes nothing like that to compete with it on 3rd world fuel economy....namely because it doesn't make cars in the 3rd world either.

Jeep has well and truly blown it in Europe. BMW and Land Rover have taken the premium market, whilst Kia and Honda have picked up the bottom end. Even in the US they are struggling to match the imports.

Except you forget that the European market is completely irrelevant.

[rmc523]

TStag, on Jan 2 2008, 07:10 PM, said:

Hmm so why have Jeep sales fallen off the side of a cliff in Europe, whilst Land Rover has been booming, whilst in many cases charging twice as much money. In addition why is Jeep loosing sales to Land Rover in it's home market by not producing cars that compete with things like the Range Rover and the Freelander? Also what does Land Rover make that is as awfull as the Compas? In fact does anyone make anything as bad as the compass? But ok, I admit it Land Rover makes nothing like that to compete with it on 3rd world fuel economy....namely because it doesn't make cars in the 3rd world either.

Jeep has well and truly blown it in Europe. BMW and Land Rover have taken the premium market, whilst Kia and Honda have picked up the bottom end. Even in the US they are struggling to match the imports.

I personally, wouldn't compare Jeep and Land Rover. The only thing they compare in is off-road capabilties and for Jeep that, IMO, lies in one vehicle: Wrangler, not really the whole lineup, even though some of the other vehicles can go off-roading. ALL of Land Rover's vehicles from Freelander 2/LR2 up to Range Rover, are designed specifically to go off-roading and have LR's Terrain Response System. Add to that, LR's premium placement in the marketplace, and the difference between the two companies is even more evident.

[Marauder2299of7839]

Except you forget that the European market is completely irrelevant.

in 20 years Europe as a whole will either be mostly third world, or being rebuilt again by the US after WWIII.

The NA market is the one we are talking about here, and unfortunately the market ford just cant seem to figure out.

[StanM]

AlRozzi, on Jan 2 2008, 04:07 PM, said:

Before Cerberus even makes a move I would expect them to discontinue certain models. Jeep will lose the Liberty and Commander before it will be sold. I don't believe Ford would want Jeep, but if they did, I'd bet Mercury would go away.

If Ford would take Jeep, I'd ask why? To me, the best seller in the Jeep line that's worth taking is the Wrangler. But then why do that when Ford already owns Troller in Brazil and they have a very close clone of the Wrangler.

Troller T4 Trilha
http://www.troller.com.br/site.php?area1=t...r_t4_trilha.swf

The website is not English, so you'll have to interpret it.

[Blueblood]

Marauder2299of7839, on Jan 2 2008, 06:50 PM, said:

Except you forget that the European market is completely irrelevant.

in 20 years Europe as a whole will either be mostly third world, or being rebuilt again by the US after WWIII.

The NA market is the one we are talking about here, and unfortunately the market ford just cant seem to figure out.

:hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

[TomServo92]

Blueblood, on Jan 2 2008, 09:19 PM, said:

:hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

This one of those few times when we agree. :hysterical:

[suv_guy_19]

Blueblood, on Jan 2 2008, 09:19 PM, said:

:hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

I agree with you as well.... :hysterical:

[ernestb48104]

Someone is for sure dreaming, never in a million years will FORD merge with Chrysler.... Someone seriously pulled the wool on this one.....

[rmc523]

suv_guy_19, on Jan 2 2008, 10:27 PM, said:

I agree with you as well.... :hysterical:

I agree too.

[Blue II]

NLPRacing, on Jan 2 2008, 04:46 PM, said:

Are you acknowledging what "groundassault" is saying? The next Explorer/Bronco will be a true off roader? Will it have 4 doors?

Off roader has been shelved.

Highly likely GM will buy Jeep and partner it with the Hummer.

This post has been edited by Blue II: 04 January 2008 - 07:27 PM

[Mark B. Morrow]

StanM, on Jan 3 2008, 03:03 AM, said:

If Ford would take Jeep, I'd ask why? To me, the best seller in the Jeep line that's worth taking is the Wrangler. But then why do that when Ford already owns Troller in Brazil and they have a very close clone of the Wrangler.

Troller T4 Trilha
http://www.troller.com.br/site.php?area1=t...r_t4_trilha.swf

The website is not English, so you'll have to interpret it.

Holy Clone! I had never heard of Troller. How long has Ford owned the company. Is it some find of joint venture with Jeep?

[NLPRacing]

Blue II, on Jan 4 2008, 06:27 PM, said:

Off roader has been shelved.

Highly likely GM will buy Jeep and partner it with the Hummer.

I hope they "un-shelf" it like the Hurricane. Ford needs this kind of product. It would be profitable and it would be very good for their image. What's the reason not to build it?

[NLPRacing]

Mark B. Morrow, on Jan 4 2008, 06:56 PM, said:

Holy Clone! I had never heard of Troller. How long has Ford owned the company. Is it some find of joint venture with Jeep?

Not all that long, less then a year. I don't know Troller's history, but they are only about 9 years old. I doubt they had anyting to do with Jeep. In Brazil, both the Ranger and the Troller use an International sourced PowerStroke 3.0L I-4 turbo diesel. I'm not sure why Ford bought them, they only make about 1200 vehicles a year.

[AlRozzi]

Mark B. Morrow, on Jan 4 2008, 07:56 PM, said:

Holy Clone! I had never heard of Troller. How long has Ford owned the company. Is it some find of joint venture with Jeep?

Some info;

Intro: To brave the countless dunes of Ceará was the reason that Rogério Farias began to develop his Troller vehicles. In 1997, after expending a lot of effort and about USD 1 million, he supplied the first batch of prototypes to selected test driver. Thanks to another USD 9 million put up by a new partner, Mário Araripe, the Model T4 Troller began to be assembled late in 1998, incorporating the improvements suggested by the drivers. The axles came from the Grand Cherokee; the hydraulic steering, from the Omega; the gearbox, from the Ford Mustang; the motor, from the Volkswagen Santana. The body is in fiberglass.
From 2002 locally produced MWM Turbo-Diesel engines are being used in the T4. A new pick-up truck, called the Pantanal was unveiled at the 2004 Sao Paolo Autosalon.
In January, 2007 Troller was bought by Ford Brazil.