Bluecon Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article.../601090398/1014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Note to journalist: Chrysler outsold Ford throughout the late 30s and most of the 40s. Ford was the #3 player in '49, and looked to be firmly rooted there. BTW, I'd like to see the guy who thinks the Compass is a worthy alternative to the Edge. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Selby Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 I remember in the 90's, Ford was predicted to and on track to overtake GM as #1. We see how that turned out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96 Pony Posted January 11, 2006 Share Posted January 11, 2006 I can totally see it happening by 2007 but it won't last forever. Chrysler has been working on their product line longer than Ford and so far has had all hits (well, maybe not including the Crossfire). :unsure: Like Bill Ford said, after 10 years of losses and a less than spectacular line of cars, it is going to take Ford some time. But they have come back from the brink before - they'll do it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 11, 2006 Author Share Posted January 11, 2006 I can totally see it happening by 2007 but it won't last forever. Chrysler has been working on their product line longer than Ford and so far has had all hits (well, maybe not including the Crossfire). :unsure: Like Bill Ford said, after 10 years of losses and a less than spectacular line of cars, it is going to take Ford some time. But they have come back from the brink before - they'll do it again. Like Iacocca said"It's all about the product" Where is the Ford product to resurrect the company? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted January 11, 2006 Share Posted January 11, 2006 Like Iacocca said"It's all about the product" Where is the Ford product to resurrect the company? I really don't think one 'product' is going to be enough to resurrect Ford, it may have worked at Chrysler but then again look at how far sales slid an the size of the Chrysler Group before their sales began to turn around. Ford needs a combination of products in each marque's portfolio, in conjunction with a reputation of manufacturing solid vehicles. This has been performed to a degree with Ford Trucks, but needs to be hammered home with Ford Cars. If Ford continues to devlop cars such as the Fusion and Edge, as well as implement cutting-edge technology, I don't see why there should be any issues with the company sustaining it's presence in the auto industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 12, 2006 Author Share Posted January 12, 2006 I really don't think one 'product' is going to be enough to resurrect Ford, it may have worked at Chrysler but then again look at how far sales slid an the size of the Chrysler Group before their sales began to turn around. Ford needs a combination of products in each marque's portfolio, in conjunction with a reputation of manufacturing solid vehicles. This has been performed to a degree with Ford Trucks, but needs to be hammered home with Ford Cars. If Ford continues to devlop cars such as the Fusion and Edge, as well as implement cutting-edge technology, I don't see why there should be any issues with the company sustaining it's presence in the auto industry. "the product" means the companies product--not an individual product Ford has a number of problems with the company sustaining its' presence. The Ranger, CV/GM and Freestar for starters. Sales at unsustainable levels and no replacements planned. 500 sales down Mustang sales down Fusion, Milan and Zephyr sales? Explorer way down The Taurus at the end of its' lifespan? New competition from Toyota in 1/2 and 3/4ton trucks and a new GM 1/2 ton on the way. And the Fordtanic sales merrily along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
630land Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 (edited) 500 and Fusion sales up. Read the Dec. sales. What about all the unsold Dodge Rams and Durangos? I'd like to see Mopar try to get #2, and then with all the pumping out of cars, they will have all the recalls and quality bugs. By the way, there'd be no Chrysler now, if not for Daimler-Benz. Edited January 12, 2006 by 630land Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 12, 2006 Author Share Posted January 12, 2006 500 and Fusion sales up. Read the Dec. sales. What about all the unsold Dodge Rams and Durangos? I'd like to see Mopar try to get #2, and then with all the pumping out of cars, they will have all the recalls and quality bugs. By the way, there'd be no Chrysler now, if not for Daimler-Benz. Actually Toyota will likely take #2 an Chrysler #3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 Alright 630 touched on 500 sales, so I will leave that one alone. Mustang sales are leveling off, but there is a high performance version coming along. Ford Edge is being introduced for this year. Duratec 35 will start making its way into more and more cars, along with a refreshing of the 500. Ford Explorer sales will probably continue along in the fashion with a slight uptick and possibly level off. I guess when you have more than one SUV-like vehicle in your staple that's bound to happen. I'm too lazy to look and see, but I wonder what happened to Explorer sales right after the introduction of the Escape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 I'm too lazy to look and see, but I wonder what happened to Explorer sales right after the introduction of the Escape. They were still strong. They were really too different in size to be cross-shopped. On the other hand, the Freestyle likely took a bite out of them. Additionally, there was no Sport Trac in the mix to keep that volume where it was for the '04 model year. Explorer sales should at least level off in the next 12 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 The one thing I don't get is how they are touting Jeep as being the unit that will do the sales job. SUV sales are on a steep decline. All of Jeeps new lineup are refreshed SUV's. I would say with the exception of their small compact SUV, none of the line up will receive any major success in sales numbers. They will probably be hailed as good vehicles by the journalists. But in the end, it's the sales numbers that matter. And SUV's aren't where it's at in the up coming years. At least Ford is moving that direction with the Fusion, Edge, Reflex, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 13, 2006 Author Share Posted January 13, 2006 Alright 630 touched on 500 sales, so I will leave that one alone. Mustang sales are leveling off, but there is a high performance version coming along. Ford Edge is being introduced for this year. Duratec 35 will start making its way into more and more cars, along with a refreshing of the 500. Ford Explorer sales will probably continue along in the fashion with a slight uptick and possibly level off. I guess when you have more than one SUV-like vehicle in your staple that's bound to happen. I'm too lazy to look and see, but I wonder what happened to Explorer sales right after the introduction of the Escape. The 500 sales are down. Look at the numbers. Mustang sales are levelling off. That is normal. Doesn't help the bottom line. The Ford edge is not in the pipeline until the end of the year. I don't hate Ford, and I want them to succeed. They need to start movin a lot faster. Even the announcement of the cutbacks is to slow. They should start reacting. Time is short. They don't need to hit the long bomb every time. Start looking at the easy stuff. Ranger, CV/GM, and use the 4.6l in a car. That is the best car motor any of the Big 3 have. Look at the development of the Mustang fighter in WW11. Developed in a matter of months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swenson88 Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 The one thing I don't get is how they are touting Jeep as being the unit that will do the sales job. SUV sales are on a steep decline. All of Jeeps new lineup are refreshed SUV's. I would say with the exception of their small compact SUV, none of the line up will receive any major success in sales numbers. They will probably be hailed as good vehicles by the journalists. But in the end, it's the sales numbers that matter. And SUV's aren't where it's at in the up coming years. At least Ford is moving that direction with the Fusion, Edge, Reflex, etc. The reason Jeep sales will go up is simple - Jeep is adding vehicles in market niches it has never been in before. So, if they continue to sell all the vehicles they have been for years (Wrangler, Liberty, and Grand Cherokee) PLUS add new models like the Commander, Compass, and Patriot, then yes, their sales should go up, even though the SUV market is suffering (which in reality is the BOF SUV market and fullsize SUV market, similar sales declines have not been seen in midsize SUV's like the Pilot or Highlander, and CUV's are essentially taking over slowly). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 Look at the development of the Mustang fighter in WW11. Developed in a matter of months. Yeah. On an unlimited budget. Ford's deliberate approach to this will be rewarded. Unfortunately for my ego, by the time everyone realizes this they'll have forgotten they heard it here first. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 The 500 sales are down. Look at the numbers. You just CAN'T extrapolate trends from ONE month of numbers. The Five Hundred has consistently been between 7000-10,000 units per month. Some months are on the high end, some months are on the low end, but has yet to trend downward overall in any sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHOWOFF Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 When the huge horsepower race finally comes to an end as it will soon, Chrysler will be a drop in the bucket. They have ass raped the 300C platform and all of the cars built off of it are almost identical. Magnum looks like a Charger looks like a 300. And they all look like shit. Once the Hip Hop crowd finds it's next vehicle to cartoon out with 24" rims their sales numbers will drop as well because Chrylser's cars are just trendy right now. They have ZERO staying power just as they always have. GM has really spent some time lately to reinvent their cars and they are headed in the right direction with Saturn (much to my surprise) by turning it into a VW like car line. The Cadillac line is gorgeous and their new Camaro will be a success for sure. Ford is taking the smart approach and planning for the long run rather than being on top for just a short amount of time. IF they actually launch this new car line that sounds to be a direct competitor with Scion they are definitely thinking about a long term strategy. Think of this. At 18-19 years old before heading off to college a young fist time Ford customer gets their Baby Ford (Scion style car) as their first new car after driving Mom and Dad's Fusion on the weekends since they were 16. They love the car and it treats them right. It runs great, looks great and has that "cool factor". A couple of years after they get out of college and get a steady paying good job they are looking to replace that car with an SUV or some sort of higher status car. They buy an Edge. They love it. It's well built and still offers that "cool factor" and it ISN'T a wagon or Mini Van but they can haul their stuff and 2 kids in it just fine. They start making more money and want more status and they step into a Zephyr or MKS or MKX a few years later . They keep the Mustang that they bought for a weekend driver and they have a Fusion that has treated them well as a commuter car. When their kids get to the age of driving they hand them their current aged car and the process starts over again. This is the plan that Toyota and Honda have quietly put into place over the last 15 years and it has worked well for Toyota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFA Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 On the Mustang....you have to remember that it is winter and "sportscars" tend to slack off. It will kick back up when spring hits, especially the convert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 14, 2006 Author Share Posted January 14, 2006 They were still strong. They were really too different in size to be cross-shopped. On the other hand, the Freestyle likely took a bite out of them. Additionally, there was no Sport Trac in the mix to keep that volume where it was for the '04 model year. Explorer sales should at least level off in the next 12 months. No 1 trade in on the Escape is the Explorer. You just CAN'T extrapolate trends from ONE month of numbers. The Five Hundred has consistently been between 7000-10,000 units per month. Some months are on the high end, some months are on the low end, but has yet to trend downward overall in any sense. It is not just one month of sales. There has been a downward trend in 500 sales. 7500 units is not enough to keep the Chicago plant on 3 shifts. On the Mustang....you have to remember that it is winter and "sportscars" tend to slack off. It will kick back up when spring hits, especially the convert. I don't think you will see Muatang sales at the same level inn 2006 as 2005. Yeah. On an unlimited budget. Ford's deliberate approach to this will be rewarded. Unfortunately for my ego, by the time everyone realizes this they'll have forgotten they heard it here first. ... The Mustang fighter on an unlimited budget? Where do you get that from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one2gamble Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 It is not just one month of sales. There has been a downward trend in 500 sales. show me the numbers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 The Mustang fighter on an unlimited budget? Where do you get that from? Yeah. World War II was being fought. Did any of the armed forces have to ask twice for anything during WWII? Why not talk about the 32V DOHC V8 that Ford built for the Sherman Tanks and ask why it took Ford fifty years to build a production DOHC V8? ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 16, 2006 Author Share Posted January 16, 2006 Yeah. World War II was being fought. Did any of the armed forces have to ask twice for anything during WWII? Why not talk about the 32V DOHC V8 that Ford built for the Sherman Tanks and ask why it took Ford fifty years to build a production DOHC V8? ... The Mustang was commissioned by the British at a relatively low cost. Built/engineered in the USA but of British origin. The American government had a program to develop a new fighter into which they poured a lot of capital. The fighter was an abysmal failure. I imagine Ford Europe has had DOHC engines for many years. I would also imagine the Sherman tank DOHC was a production engine. I think it is unbelievable that Ford has now new product until the end of 2006. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 I think it is unbelievable that Ford has now new product until the end of 2006. What's so "unbelievable" about this? Hardly anyone will. 98% of new vehicle introductions are done in the FALL, as it has always been. And there will be at least one early-arrival model before fall: the GT500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted January 16, 2006 Author Share Posted January 16, 2006 What's so "unbelievable" about this? Hardly anyone will. 98% of new vehicle introductions are done in the FALL, as it has always been. And there will be at least one early-arrival model before fall: the GT500. No 98% of models are not released in the fall. Nowadays you start selling the product when you can get it to market. The Camry in March? Dodge Caliber,Aspen and others. And lots of other product to be released by variuos carmakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 No 98% of models are not released in the fall. Nowadays you start selling the product when you can get it to market. The Camry in March? Dodge Caliber,Aspen and others. And lots of other product to be released by variuos carmakers. Okay. You named 3. What about the other 60-70 new models coming out this year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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