mackinaw Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 From today's Automotive News: Ford Motor Co. on Sunday said it's more than doubling its investment in electrification and planning to roll out 16 fully electric vehicles within five years. It said the first of those EVs would arrive in 2020. The automaker said it would spend $11 billion on the technology by 2022 and introduce 40 electrified vehicles globally within that time. Executives said 16 would be battery electrics and 24 would be hybrids or plug-in hybrids, without specifying how many of each type. It's unclear how many of them would be sold in the U.S. Ford had committed in late 2015 to spending $4.5 billion to develop 13 electrified vehicles over a five-year period, including one battery electric: a 300-mile range crossover expected in 2020. http://www.autonews.com/article/20180114/OEM05/180119837/ford-ups-electrification-investment-to-11b-plans-16-battery-electric 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve557 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I have heard this electric spiele a few times in the last thirty years... never goes anywhere. I thought I read something about the North east power grid maxed out during recent cold spell? Or maybe recent requests to lower electricity use in North Carolina due to cold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Smart move by Ford. 2022 is the year when electric cars are expected to achieve price parity with regular gasoline and diesel powered cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Yawn. There's no indication these won't rot on the lot like the bolt and leaf do. I really have to question Ford Management's decisions here since this level of investment will deny the ICE programs much needed capital. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve557 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Yawn. There's no indication these won't rot on the lot like the bolt and leaf do. I really have to question Ford Management's decisions here since this level of investment will deny the ICE programs much needed capital. For sure, this will end up as another electric failure. Between this and the self driving fad I am not sure which is worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I'm wondering (hoping) if it's not simply that CD6 will be HEV/PHEV/BEV capable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) Smart move by Ford. 2022 is the year when electric cars are expected to achieve price parity with regular gasoline and diesel powered cars. Yeah; and I believe manual transmissions will make a stunning comeback starting in 2020. Just because some analyst thinks he can predict the future doesn't mean anyone should pay attention. I mean, geez, he could have at least used something a little more complex than a simple exponential equation to make that pretty Excel bar chart. At least a third order polynomial equation or something. I'm sure you realize these are the same folks that have been saying "electrics will become mainstream in just a few more years" since about 1985. It's a pipe dream. #1, the electric grid simply can't support it. Not even close. #2, there's no charging infrastructure, nor is there any demand for said infrastructure outside of dense urban centers. It'll be several more decades before electrics have significant market share. You'll know we're getting close when we as a nation decide it's time to replace, harden, and expand the existing grid. Until then, it's a passing pipe dream that shouldn't be receiving significant capital investment from the automakers. Edited January 15, 2018 by Sevensecondsuv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I'm wondering (hoping) if it's not simply that CD6 will be HEV/PHEV/BEV capable. theyve said several times that all future platforms will be HEV/PHEV/BEV capable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Hmm I missed this announcement. Id have to assume that some of them are variations of existing models, whereas some will Be their own unique models, like the Mach 1 thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 For sure, this will end up as another electric failure. Between this and the self driving fad I am not sure which is worse. You ever hear of China? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve557 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) You ever hear of China? I think I have heard it a few times in my life? I prefer just to looks at actual occurrences/facts which point to a grid that cannot support widespread electrics and thus far American buying preferences. Giant waste of money by Ford. Edited January 15, 2018 by Steve557 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 You ever hear of China? The country we import a lot of junk from? One large container ship that bring that junk over produce as much pollution as millions of cars. MILLIONS! Seems we could improve the earth by building products here and getting rid of those ocean-going planet killers. That China? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 The China that is the largest car market in the world. And the one that is leading the rest of the world into the BEV age. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 The China that is the largest car market in the world. And the one that is leading the rest of the world into the BEV age. I don't care about China. It may be the largest but the money is made in North America. Money being wasted around the globe. I can't find the 2017 results, but this is good enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnm Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 On this topic, I dont think the oil companies are going to just sit back and watch their world get eaten alive by EVs. Wont they attemp to keep people in ICE cars by keeping the cost of fuel low? Bad for their profits, but good for the customers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I think I have heard it a few times in my life? I prefer just to looks at actual occurrences/facts which point to a grid that cannot support widespread electrics and thus far American buying preferences. Giant waste of money by Ford. Oncor Electric Delivery here in Texas reported that it is continually keeping aware of circuit penetration levels from EVSE, especially residential. No major issues with overloading now. They recommend that EV owners charging their vehicles at home do so during off peak hours. https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/df5b3b_177c4f0da9ea4d0288c487c8d50f7c4c.pdf Preparing for the future isn't a waste of money. Ford doesn't want to be caught flat footed as electrified vehicles become the norm. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve557 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Oncor Electric Delivery here in Texas reported that it is continually keeping aware of circuit penetration levels from EVSE, especially residential. No major issues with overloading now. They recommend that EV owners charging their vehicles at home do so during off peak hours. https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/df5b3b_177c4f0da9ea4d0288c487c8d50f7c4c.pdf Preparing for the future isn't a waste of money. Ford doesn't want to be caught flat footed as electrified vehicles become the norm. That's great and all along the East Coast during recent cold spell people were told to limit energy usage. https://www.wwaytv3.com/2018/01/14/duke-energy-asks-customers-to-reduce-electricity-use-during-cold-snap/ History shows us electric vehicles will never become the norm, ICE is here to stay for a long time. Not like some power plants aren't powered by sources worse than what gasoline motor puts out. Here in New England they recently had to relax environmental regulations to allow plants to run more coal due to very high demand. Our grid just simply cannot handle widespread electric vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 On this topic, I dont think the oil companies are going to just sit back and watch their world get eaten alive by EVs. You are correct sir. For example Royal Dutch Shell has made investments in EV infrastructure already. Late in 2017 Shell bought a company that provides over 30,000 EV charging stations in Europe. They also partnered with a German company to roll out hundreds of EV fast chargers at existing Shell filling stations. https://www.investors.com/news/heres-how-this-oil-giant-is-preparing-for-an-electric-vehicle-future/ Shell's CEO bought a PHEV and the company's CFO has an EV. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-27/shell-ceo-van-beurden-says-his-next-car-will-be-electric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I think that Ford announcement is all hype, 40 EVs by 2020, that has to be all about Chinese compliance vehicles This is Ford spinning the crap out of being involved with other Chinese partners to get it done in time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I think that Ford announcement is all hype, 40 EVs by 2020, that has to be all about Chinese compliance vehicles This is Ford spinning the crap out of being involved with other Chinese partners to get it done in time. $11 billion is a lot of crap spinning. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) Like it or not, BEVs are going to be come more of a market force. Seems like everyone has forgotten about CAFE regulations too...I know there's been talk about punting them down the road, but to still make the 2025 regulations is going to take something else besides improvements in Gas powered vehicles. ICE is more or less a technological dead-end, but keep in mind we have 800HP cars that can be driven every day and are reliable. Where else do they need to go? 1000HP? Do we really need that much power in a car/truck? As long as you don't have to drive more then 250 miles in one shot (and need to get going right away during a recharge), a BEV should be able to handle that and be affordable for most people within the next 10-15 years. Performance isn't an issue either... I don't see my next car as a BEV, but the one I get in late 2020 will most likely be one. Edited January 15, 2018 by silvrsvt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Like it or not, BEVs are going to be come more of a market force. Seems like everyone has forgotten about CAFE regulations too...I know there's been talk about punting them down the road, but to still make the 2025 regulations is going to take something else besides improvements in Gas powered vehicles. ICE is more or less a technological dead-end, but keep in mind we have 800HP cars that can be driven every day and are reliable. Where else do they need to go? 1000HP? Do we really need that much power in a car/truck? As long as you don't have to drive more then 250 miles in one shot (and need to get going right away during a recharge), a BEV should be able to handle that and be affordable for most people within the next 10-15 years. Performance isn't an issue either... just please for the love of all things holy dont call it a Mach 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 just please for the love of all things holy dont call it a Mach 1 There's a campaign going on at the allfordmustangs site. They encourage people to send complaints directly to Mike Levine. http://www.allfordmustangs.com/2018/01/14/please-tell-ford-not-make-mach-1-electric-suv/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I would like to see one of the automotive journalists do some digging and find out about the BEV chassis at Ford. As I wrote in another thread, will this be a true bespoke chassis for BEV duty, ala Tesla? If it is, does Ford plan for all 16 BEV's to come from this chassis? Could the chassis truly be that capable? That would be a lot of product development bang for the buck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 Raj Nair, when he was still in charge of product development, said that all future Ford platforms would be dual function, designed to accommodate batteries and/or a conventional ICE powertrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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