jcartwright99 Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 If you think that most people are going to go from ICE engines straight to electric, you are sorely mistaken. This is where Ford and Lincoln, really need to take what they have learned from hybrid development and really kick it up a notch. Hybrids will be the transitional auto to fully electric. Hybrids have been around for a while, so there is some faith that they won't leave you stranded. The fully electric vehicles have too many variables that can leave you stranded or fully derail your travel times. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Hybrids can be used with small engines to achieve high MPG or (as is the case with most luxury hybrids) to achieve high performance while maintaining decent MPG. It helps with CAFE and it hedges against future gas price hikes and it can be added to almost any production vehicle. It's a no-brainer. Fully electric vehicles will continue to be a niche until recharging becomes as efficient and quick as refueling with gasoline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 This seems to be a marketing move as much as anything - Lincoln needs to keep up with Volvo and Jaguar (both have made similar announcements). From a product line perspective, the only news here is the implied confirmation that the Aviator will have a hybrid variant, which in turn confirms the Explorer hybrid, which in turn confirms CD6 hybrid capability (not a surprise, but still...) AND if CD6 gets hybrid capability, then Continental comes into play. AND the MKX gets hybrid capability, which in turn means Edge will get a hybrid variant. Other than those, the remainder of the product line is accounted for: MKC hybrid was known given Escape news, MKZ would most certainly continue to have a hybrid with Fusion, Navi will get the Expedition hybrid treatment. If Lincoln offers an all electric vehicle, it would almost certainly be derived from Model E with a Lincoln top hat. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 If Lincoln offers an all electric vehicle, it would almost certainly be derived from Model E with a Lincoln top hat. But where the Ford could be more for mileage the Lincoln could go the Tesla route and use High Performance Electric motors. No reason Lincoln can't also have Sub 3 second 0-60 electric car, especially if it was a high styled coupe and convertible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Whatever they do it better not be an ELR. If they can scale up the model E platform or if CD6 can accomodate the model E drivetrain with a larger battery pack then a fully electric MKZ or Conti might make sense. But I don't see a bespoke Tesla model S competitor. More likely we'll see a MkC BEV with a 300 mile range based on model E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 The powertrain electrification plans should make Lincoln more competitive. Hopefully the upcoming Lincoln hybrids and plug ins will be distinct from Ford hybrids and plug ins, with more powerful motors and longer electric only range. Right now, almost all Lincoln cars and SUVs have the same engines and transmissions as Fords. That hurts Lincoln's image as a luxury car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) Right now, almost all Lincoln cars and SUVs have the same engines and transmissions as Fords. That hurts Lincoln's image as a luxury car. That's only true for MKX which shares the 2.7T with Fusion Sport. Navigator 3.5T has more power than Expedition 3.5T. MKC offers the 2.3T over the Escape 2.0T. MKZ and Continental both offer the 3.0T not available on any Ford. MKX should get the 3.0T next year. If you're implying the 3.5T and 2.3T are somehow tarnished because they're also used in other Ford products that's hogwash. It's more appropriate to say Ford is putting Lincoln drivetrains in some of their products like the Focus RS, Fusion Sport and Edge Sport. If you're implying they need specialty models with bespoke drivetrains such as AMG, M or S models I again disagree. Because people who buy AMG S63s or M5s and M6s are not going to look at a Lincoln to begin with. Edited September 8, 2017 by akirby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted September 8, 2017 Author Share Posted September 8, 2017 The powertrain electrification plans should make Lincoln more competitive. Hopefully the upcoming Lincoln hybrids and plug ins will be distinct from Ford hybrids and plug ins, with more powerful motors and longer electric only range. Right now, almost all Lincoln cars and SUVs have the same engines and transmissions as Fords. That hurts Lincoln's image as a luxury car. Let's not pretend like most people know what's under the hood these days anyway. Especially since they're transitioning away from using the EcoBoost name/badging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) . Edited September 8, 2017 by akirby politics 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) . Edited September 8, 2017 by akirby Not the place for politics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 I'd take a hybrid.... it would HAVE to be RWD-bias AWD, and be Continental size and have at least 500hp, and be extremely luxurious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Personally I just want to see a full size gas guzzling monster with either the upcoming 7.0L V8 or the 5.4T V12 (double 2.7s we were discussing in the other thread). Also need rear leg room equal or better than the old Town Car L. Basically everything a Lincoln should be lol!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) I've seen it speculated that the hold-up is a Fomoco battery factory for Fomoco battery supply Ford has 2 or 3 idled parts plants in Southeastern Michigan it can't sell. They could be converted to battery production in no time. Edited September 8, 2017 by Pioneer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Personally I just want to see a full size gas guzzling monster with either the upcoming 7.0L V8 or the 5.4T V12 (double 2.7s we were discussing in the other thread). Also need rear leg room equal or better than the old Town Car L. Basically everything a Lincoln should be lol!! You forgot bench seat and BOF..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 (edited) well....how 'bout that Edited September 8, 2017 by twintornados Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W. Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 You forgot bench seat and BOF......., and Opera windows in the back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Personally I just want to see a full size gas guzzling monster with either the upcoming 7.0L V8 or the 5.4T V12 (double 2.7s we were discussing in the other thread). Also need rear leg room equal or better than the old Town Car L. Basically everything a Lincoln should be lol!! Ideally I want this, but I'd like a fuel efficient TTV8 10 speed auto, even though I hate all the gears and paddle shifters - better fuel efficiency. Also, I despise front bench seats. I'd prefer a column shifter, and a nice big center console. This would give the Americans what the Germans give. I'd love it.... It would cost $100k, but it's worth it. After all, it's not a Ford, it is a premium luxury sedan and rightfully so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Realistically, I'd rather have true rear wheel bias and take electric power vs front wheel and small turbo engines. They can't say it's bad for mpg to have a RWD electric! Highly doubtful it makes much of a difference in that setting, especially considering they can have a more powerful motor in back and a smaller one in front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 You forgot bench seat and BOF..... You know, I thought about it and decided I could compromise on those since it's like 2017 or something. But it'd definitely have to have three pedals!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 This would have been done much, much sooner... but, you know. Blame the hair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang_sallad Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Ideally I want this, but I'd like a fuel efficient TTV8 10 speed auto, even though I hate all the gears and paddle shifters - better fuel efficiency. Also, I despise front bench seats. I'd prefer a column shifter, and a nice big center console. This would give the Americans what the Germans give. I'd love it.... It would cost $100k, but it's worth it. After all, it's not a Ford, it is a premium luxury sedan and rightfully so. Wow, 8 cylinders, 2 turbos, and a 10 speed transmission to hopefully approach 40% efficiency in the best case while cruising on the highway at a steady speed. Tesla gets 400hp out of a motor the size of a bucket that gets full torque at 0rpm and revs up to 12,000rpm, letting it run with a single speed transmission and get 80-90% efficiency all day long, getting 300 miles out of a full charge that costs $12 at the average US electricity price. EV sales have grown at over 50% yoy every year since they launched around 2011, I think they're on track for something like 60% so far this year, with over 30 models available in the US. But you're right, probably a fad... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msm859 Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Wow, 8 cylinders, 2 turbos, and a 10 speed transmission to hopefully approach 40% efficiency in the best case while cruising on the highway at a steady speed. Tesla gets 400hp out of a motor the size of a bucket that gets full torque at 0rpm and revs up to 12,000rpm, letting it run with a single speed transmission and get 80-90% efficiency all day long, getting 300 miles out of a full charge that costs $12 at the average US electricity price. EV sales have grown at over 50% yoy every year since they launched around 2011, I think they're on track for something like 60% so far this year, with over 30 models available in the US. But you're right, probably a fad... "Fad" Reminds of the statement Steve Ballmer made about the original iPhone. My son has a 2012 Chevy Volt. In 5 years he is averaging over 180 mpg (yes I know that it is offset by electricity) has changed the oil twice and air filter once - $70 maintenance in 5 years. zero problems. Ford is behind the curve ball on this. The new Explorer/Aviator should be taking aim at the Volvo XC90. Have an ecoboost 4 cylinder driving the front wheels and 2 100 hp motors driving each rear wheel. They probably need at least a 16kw battery to get an honest 30+ miles pure electric range. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 How do you know I'm not going to a top college in the country looking to get a career as an automotive engineer? Call it a hunch: After all, people like me are far smarter than people 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Tesla gets 400hp out of a motor the size of a bucket that gets full torque at 0rpm and revs up to 12,000rpm, letting it run with a single speed transmission and get 80-90% efficiency all day long, getting 300 miles out of a full charge... Which was most likely generated at a fossil fuel power plant running at about 35% thermal efficiency. Also the nukes run at about 35% thermal efficiency too since the secondary plant is the same as a fossil plant. Just a reminder to consider the whole picture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnLover Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Wow, 8 cylinders, 2 turbos, and a 10 speed transmission to hopefully approach 40% efficiency in the best case while cruising on the highway at a steady speed. Tesla gets 400hp out of a motor the size of a bucket that gets full torque at 0rpm and revs up to 12,000rpm, letting it run with a single speed transmission and get 80-90% efficiency all day long, getting 300 miles out of a full charge that costs $12 at the average US electricity price. EV sales have grown at over 50% yoy every year since they launched around 2011, I think they're on track for something like 60% so far this year, with over 30 models available in the US. But you're right, probably a fad... Come on now..... you know darn well Ford or any other manufacturer would never do what Tesla has done. They will go bankrupt, I'm betting on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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