GM July 2017 Sales Down 15.4%

[silvrsvt]

Ford is all over the map at the moment, Fields tried to coast through the recession with cars and utilities at hand

now Hackett has the job of correcting that and getting Ford back into the game, not just doing the easy stuff..

 

 

The thing I really can't wrap my head around was this time last year there was a full on expectation of gloom and doom in the United States slipping back into a recession by this time. Yet, we 22K in the stock market and IMO the economy has been at its best since pre 2008-09 levels.

 

Interesting what happens when you have a change in administrations...

[MY93SHO]

 

 

The thing I really can't wrap my head around was this time last year there was a full on expectation of gloom and doom in the United States slipping back into a recession by this time. Yet, we 22K in the stock market and IMO the economy has been at its best since pre 2008-09 levels.

 

Interesting what happens when you have a change in administrations...

"administrations."

 

Is that what you call this?

[grbeck]

The New York City metropolitan area is one of the largest - if not THE largest - new-car markets in the nation. It's also a huge market for luxury vehicles. Plenty of area residents still own cars. Even if they take mass transit to work from the suburbs (or even Queens or Brooklyn), they still own one or two cars for the weekend and evening use. And many rich Manhattan residents maintain a country home in upstate New York, and keep a vehicle there.

 

(And I'll note that many of the supposedly "anti-car" young people I know quietly changed their tune once they could actually afford one.)

 

Cadillac's effort to discern the taste of New York City residents isn't misguided. Peddling aging Broughams to retired World War II and Korean War vets is an obvious dead end, and despite what one reads on the internet, most new-car buyers aren't pining for the return of tail fins or vinyl roofs. (Although more than a few hipsters would be happy to drive a 1960s or 1970s Cadillac to make a statement.)

 

Whether opening a coffee shop and focusing on wannabee BWM sedans instead of crossovers are the correct strategies for Cadillac is another matter.

Edited August 3, 2017 by grbeck

[tbone]

I personally think it has to do with the executives for that company wanting to live in a certain area, and they justify it with this or that reason. Just like Caterpillar moving its headquarters from Peoria to Chicago, where they have very little manufacturing footprint and I are actually closing of one of its large factories. The same could be said for Boeing.

Edited August 3, 2017 by tbone

[Fgts]

The New York City metropolitan area is one of the largest - if not THE largest - new-car markets in the nation. It's also a huge market for luxury vehicles. Plenty of area residents still own cars. Even if they take mass transit to work from the suburbs (or even Queens or Brooklyn), they still own one or two cars for the weekend and evening use. And many rich Manhattan residents maintain a country home in upstate New York, and keep a vehicle there.

 

(And I'll note that many of the supposedly "anti-car" young people I know quietly changed their tune once they could actually afford one.)

 

Cadillac's effort to discern the taste of New York City residents isn't misguided. Peddling aging Broughams to retired World War II and Korean War vets is an obvious dead end, and despite what one reads on the internet, most new-car buyers aren't pining for the return of tail fins or vinyl roofs. (Although more than a few hipsters would be happy to drive a 1960s or 1970s Cadillac to make a statement.)

 

Whether opening a coffee shop and focusing on wannabee BWM sedans instead of crossovers are the correct strategies for Cadillac is another matter.

To add to that IIRC, Cadillac is well represented in NJ with still many Cadillacs moved in the immediate NYC area of North Jersey.

[silvrsvt]

"administrations."

 

Is that what you call this?

 

I'll be the first to say yeah it's a shitshow now...but doesn't seem to be affecting the economy at least.

[silvrsvt]

To add to that IIRC, Cadillac is well represented in NJ with still many Cadillacs moved in the immediate NYC area of North Jersey.

 

NJ also happens to be one of the biggest Lincoln markets also...so not exactly sure what your point is.

[fuzzymoomoo]

 

I'll be the first to say yeah it's a shitshow now...but doesn't seem to be affecting the economy at least.

he hasn't had a chance to fuck it up yet

 

Too busy worrying about stupid bullshit.

[jpd80]

The thing I really can't wrap my head around was this time last year there was a full on expectation of gloom and doom in the United States slipping back into a recession by this time. Yet, we 22K in the stock market and IMO the economy has been at its best since pre 2008-09 levels.

 

Interesting what happens when you have a change in administrations...

Or was Ford hyping the nosing over of sales to suit Field's agenda?

Just because car sales are going away doesn't mean utilities and trucks will follow

[Fgts]

 

NJ also happens to be one of the biggest Lincoln markets also...so not exactly sure what your point is.

Point is Cadillac sets up shop where they wanted at, not some mid-west, out-of-touch hellhole (Detroit). The Lincolns that do sell there are MKXs, other then that its "555-1212" yellow taxis and limos. Edited August 4, 2017 by Fgts

[tbone]

Point is Cadillac sets up shop where they wanted at, not some mid-west, out-of-touch hellhole (Detroit). The Lincolns that do sell there are MKTs, other then that its "555-1212" yellow taxis and limos.

You have no point because you have no factual information that suggests that Cadillac is benefiting in anyway from having their headquarters in New York.

[jpd80]

Like Lincoln, Cadillac has three areas where it sell well - New York / New Jersey, Florida and California.

I remember seeing similar said about California being a very strong state for Flex..

Edited August 4, 2017 by jpd80

[RichardJensen]

the only problem was that

BMW changed the sizes of it 3 and 5 series cars, something GM could have never anticipated.

 

Unless they had looked at four decades' worth of industry trends.

 

But that's GM: They're in the business of building BMW fighters. First BMW builds something, and then GM copies it. Heaven forbid GM try to get in front of anyone, or chart their own path.

[jpd80]

 

Unless they had looked at four decades' worth of industry trends.

 

But that's GM: They're in the business of building BMW fighters. First BMW builds something, and then GM copies it. Heaven forbid GM try to get in front of anyone, or chart their own path.

And now they're stuck with their choices like a dirty nappy, so many unsold vehicles in comparison to Ford,

so many plants dedicated to cars with those sales in decline - I think GM is about to do a major reshuffle

and consolidation of product. Surely GM can't limp along with so many plants back to single shift.

 

I remember what you warned us about with GM looking to copy Ford's efficiencies, GM doesn't properly

control production and inventory, choosing instead to trade higher on more products and increased incentives.

I don't see them getting through all that inventory pile up and, selling so many more utilities and that's why

i suspect that Ford will continue selling its aging Utilities with little direct influence from GM...

 

PS,

Cadillac went through all the pain of establishing Sigma CTS only to throw that market away,

split it in two chasing BMW with vehicles that were then undersized compared to the competition.

On top of that, GM holds fast on premium pricing while BMW offers buyers killer lease deals all while

its ATS inventory rises and then the fire sale begins.... and then GM repeats the same mistake with CTS.

Completing a clean sweep, it tries the same Alpha premium pricing nonsense with Camaro and then the

reality strikes as Grand River goes to a single shift.....I think Alpha's goose is cooked thanks to GM's vanity.

Edited August 5, 2017 by jpd80

[rperez817]

 

But that's GM: They're in the business of building BMW fighters. First BMW builds something, and then GM copies it. Heaven forbid GM try to get in front of anyone, or chart their own path.

 

GM has charted their own path sir. Some of their new cars like Camaro and Cadillac CTS are better to drive than BMW cars. http://www.motortrend.com/news/revelation-chevy-thats-better-bmw/

 

I think BMW has lost its way with its most recent cars. They're no longer "Ultimate Driving Machines", no longer truly special. Good thing GM, Jaguar, Alfa Romeo, and others have put into their cars the driving excitement missing in BMW autos.

[fuzzymoomoo]

The only thing special about driving an Alfa is the special ways it finds to break down....

[RichardJensen]

 

GM has charted their own path sir.

 

https://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/16/cadillac-ats-to-show-how-much-gm-learned-from-the-bmw-3-series/

[jpd80]

^^^^^

According to our source, teams at GM have basically stripped various 3 Series cars down to bare naked chassis bits and pieces, and fully intend on emulating an awful lot of what they see there, while, it can be assured, making it all correct for the Cadillac brand.

 

 

 

...their own path my ass, Cadillac copied the 3 and 5 series to a tee....and those buyers don't want faux BMW

 

and changing the badges to CT4 and CT5 is like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic (Grand River)

Rather than an exercise in brand building for Cadillac, this has been flattery of the highest order to BMW...

Edited August 5, 2017 by jpd80

[rmc523]

 

GM has charted their own path sir. Some of their new cars like Camaro and Cadillac CTS are better to drive than BMW cars. http://www.motortrend.com/news/revelation-chevy-thats-better-bmw/

 

I think BMW has lost its way with its most recent cars. They're no longer "Ultimate Driving Machines", no longer truly special. Good thing GM, Jaguar, Alfa Romeo, and others have put into their cars the driving excitement missing in BMW autos.

 

Right, they made BMWs. And see how that's working for them...

[silvrsvt]

And using motor trend as a citation needs their head examended since manufactures more or less buy the COY awards.

[jpd80]

And using motor trend as a citation needs their head examended since manufactures more or less buy the COY awards.

Correct, MT are "GM friendly" anyway so the preferences are always going to go their way.

[grbeck]

Judging by early road tests of the new Alfa, the greatest excitement will be getting to and from your destination without any problems.

 

That's the kind of excitement, however, the tends to boost sales of Lexus over the long run.

[Fgts]

^^^^^

 

 

 

...their own path my ass, Cadillac copied the 3 and 5 series to a tee....and those buyers don't want faux BMW

 

and changing the badges to CT4 and CT5 is like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic (Grand River)

Rather than an exercise in brand building for Cadillac, this has been flattery of the highest order to BMW...

Ok, you have the solutions, so what you have that work? (The XTS sold the least last month, so it isn't because people want that type of car).

[rperez817]

 

Right, they made BMWs. And see how that's working for them...

 

No sir, they made cars with their own character that are better to drive than comparable BMWs. Crossovers too in the case of Jaguar and Alfa Romeo.

[rmc523]

 

No sir, they made cars with their own character that are better to drive than comparable BMWs. Crossovers too in the case of Jaguar and Alfa Romeo.

First, it's extremely evident they were essentially making BMW clones - they've even said as much.

 

And even so, clearly the market doesn't like "their own character that are better to drive than comparable BMWs."

Edited August 8, 2017 by rmc523