papilgee4evaeva Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 If it's an engine problem, has this occurred with other Ford/Lincoln models using the same engine? If it's a platform problem, has this occurred with other D3/D4 vehicles? If it's an Explorer problem, has this occurred with all available engines? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 The latest take from Ford (in articles I've read) is that Ford attributes the problem on PIU's to the installation of aftermarket equipment related to police work. The installation includes drilling of holes in the chassis, which in turn allows fumes into the vehicle (I'm simplifying here). Ford points out that this is occurring beyond the factory and involves aftermarket installations, but nonetheless says it will pay for the sealing of said holes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 Here's a good example of the above (with more info): In a statement released late Friday, Ford said it has discovered holes and unsealed spaces in the back of some Police Interceptors that had equipment installed after leaving Ford’s factory. Ford said police and fire departments routinely drill holes in the backs of vehicles to add customized lighting, radios and other equipment. Ford said it will cover the cost of repairs to any Police Interceptor that may have this concern, regardless of age, mileage or modifications. The company said it will check for holes and seal them, recalibrate the air conditioning to bring in more fresh air during heavy acceleration and check engine codes to see if the vehicles have a damaged exhaust manifold.“There is nothing we take more seriously than providing you with the safest and most reliable vehicles,” said Hau Thai-Tang, Ford’s executive vice president of product development. Non-police customers should take their Explorers to a Ford dealer to address the issue, the company said. http://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/ford/2017/07/28/ford-explorer-fumes/104068344/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) Right, but I'm mainly concerned with the examples that aren't fitted for police work. It's good that Ford will cover those too (as they should), but if they haven't had the aftermarket treatment and are satisfactorily fixed anyway, that lends itself to the possibility of the modifications not being the issue. Edited July 31, 2017 by papilgee4evaeva Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 There are clearly 2 different but possibly related issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Right, but I'm mainly concerned with the examples that aren't fitted for police work. It's good that Ford will cover those too (as they should), but if they haven't had the aftermarket treatment and are satisfactorily fixed anyway, that lends itself to the possibility of the modifications not being the issue. AFAIK there hasn't been any reported examples that aren't upfitted for police work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 AFAIK there hasn't been any reported examples that aren't upfitted for police work? That Ford has repair advice for civilian customers implies that they at least deem it possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 There have been reports of exhaust smell but only under WOT in civilian explorers and maybe some other vehicles. But no CO poisoning. That's why these appear to be 2 different issues although part of the cause may be the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 There have been reports of exhaust smell but only under WOT in civilian explorers and maybe some other vehicles. But no CO poisoning. That's why these appear to be 2 different issues although part of the cause may be the same. "OK, Mr. Jones, just open 'er up on your way back home and call us if you get dizzy." That brings me back to my original questions though, but I'll narrow them way down... does anyone know of any similar reports with, say, the Taurus PIs? Because if we're continuing with aftermarket modifications being the culprit, then you have to cast your eye at the sedans too, however unpopular they may be in comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Ok, let's try this again. The general problem seems to be limited to Explorer (and possibly Flex and MKT). Under normal circumstances this produces an exhaust smell only at WOT and only for brief periods. When you ADD the aftermarket modifications to the PIUs it becomes much more serious because of the holes and (presumably) extended idling. The fix for PIUs don't apply to civilian explorers. And it doesn't fix the underlying exhaust leak problem - but it should fix the CO poisoning issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdegrand Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 I enjoy watching LIVE PD....on Friday and Saturday nights. The cops in hot Arizona and South Carolina still using lots of Explorers. Hopefully, the Austin issue was aftermarket installation. We don't need anymore bad press. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Ok, let's try this again. The general problem seems to be limited to Explorer (and possibly Flex and MKT). Under normal circumstances this produces an exhaust smell only at WOT and only for brief periods. When you ADD the aftermarket modifications to the PIUs it becomes much more serious because of the holes and (presumably) extended idling. The fix for PIUs don't apply to civilian explorers. And it doesn't fix the underlying exhaust leak problem - but it should fix the CO poisoning issue. Fair enough, I suppose. I guess, as far as my wondering aloud about how widespread the problem was, now we have to wait until NHTSA finishes investigating seemingly every D4 Explorer ever built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Well last nights Boston news reported another accident in which PIU struck a car.- town of Auburn MA. Cop was "overcome" by carbon monoxide. Fox station then went for a ride in a Fire Department Explorer that was reported to be..."Non PI version-just like the civilian version but was reporting high levels. Of course while they said it was NOT a PI (was in fire service) no comment was made about any aftermarket equipment was added. Ford engineers were meeting with town officials this morning. Like I said, the fact that this has gone on for as long as it has, once that first accident happened-Calif??- Ford should have been all over it like a wet blanket. Would seem that going forward, every accident involving a PI will for sure be "vehicle issue". Let's see if you work 40 hours of paid details in addition to your normal shift, at what point in time are you more susceptible for "getting sleepy" because of "carbon monoxide".? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Well last nights Boston news reported another accident in which PIU struck a car.- town of Auburn MA. Cop was "overcome" by carbon monoxide. Fox station then went for a ride in a Fire Department Explorer that was reported to be..."Non PI version-just like the civilian version but was reporting high levels. Of course while they said it was NOT a PI (was in fire service) no comment was made about any aftermarket equipment was added. Ford engineers were meeting with town officials this morning. Like I said, the fact that this has gone on for as long as it has, once that first accident happened-Calif??- Ford should have been all over it like a wet blanket. Would seem that going forward, every accident involving a PI will for sure be "vehicle issue". Let's see if you work 40 hours of paid details in addition to your normal shift, at what point in time are you more susceptible for "getting sleepy" because of "carbon monoxide".? So wait. They're complaining - after an accident - that the compartment may not be completely sealed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 So wait. They're complaining - after an accident - that the compartment may not be completely sealed? The CO poisoning supposedly occurred before the accident and was the cause of the accident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 The CO poisoning supposedly occurred before the accident and was the cause of the accident. Ah, I was too lazy to look it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 This seems like a built in excuse for causing an accident. Not that the officer isn't telling the truth, but is there a way to prove this is what happened? This issue is so strange to me. I wonder what the percentage of affected vehicles are? I have not heard anything about this issue from Chicago Police Dept, and they have tons of PIUs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 This seems like a built in excuse for causing an accident. Not that the officer isn't telling the truth, but is there a way to prove this is what happened? Proven with a blood test. AUBURN, Mass. — A police officer who passed out while driving his cruiser tested positive for carbon monoxide exposure, the chief said. Auburn Police Department Chief Andrew Sluckis confirmed the crash occurred around 11 a.m. Wednesday in the area of Auburn and Oxford streets. He said the officer, a veteran of more than 20 years, passed out and rear-ended another vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Good to know. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 This issue is so strange to me. I wonder what the percentage of affected vehicles are? I have not heard anything about this issue from Chicago Police Dept, and they have tons of PIUs. The OKC Fox affiliate reported on this a day or two ago, and they included a statement from OCPD that they've not seen this problem on their vehicles. It looks like it's entirely dependent on the department's aftermarket equipment and how they break the cabin seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 It looks like it's entirely dependent on the department's aftermarket equipment and how they break the cabin seal. Bingo. Which reinforces that this isn't a PIU problem per se. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Bingo. Which reinforces that this isn't a PIU problem per se. It also says something about how important the market and PR are, as Ford is essentially saying that they'll cover problems being caused by stupid installers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 http://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/ford/2017/08/03/ford-explorer-carbon-monoxide/104254060/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 There was a report of possible cracks in exhaust manifolds passing gas at full power and that fume being picked up by the A/C either front or rear to which Ford is reprogramming to add more fresh air . If there was a leak near the HVAC pick up, wouldn't you want recirc under full power? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 If it were a specifically an issue due to aftermarket equipment installation, why wouldn't non-Explorer police vehicles that had aftermarket equipment installed have the same issue? It would seem the Explorer is just susceptible to this as some form of design flaw. Having the aftermarket equipment possibly allowing small air gaps is the proverbial straw that broke that camel's back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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