silvrsvt Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 http://autoweek.com/article/green-cars/teslas-fremont-plant-doesnt-have-enough-parking-employees-because-plant-so It’s because in this temple of lean manufacturing, Tesla uses far more workers than NUMMI employed to build far fewer cars. In 1985, its first full year of production, NUMMI had 2,470 employees and produced 64,764 vehicles — about 26 vehicles per worker per year. By 1997, it had 4,844 workers and produced 357,809 vehicles — about 74 vehicles per worker per year. Tesla, on the other hand, had between 6,000 and 10,000 workers in 2016 and manufactured 83,922 vehicles. That puts its vehicle-per-worker number between 8 and 14, about one-seventh the efficiency of NUMMI at its peak. FFS! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 Tesla is more vertically integrated than regular automakers. That decreases the vehicle per worker number. What other automakers rely on suppliers for, Tesla often does in-house. This makes Tesla the most "American" automaker. https://evannex.com/blogs/news/vertical-integration-how-elon-musk-employs-an-old-successful-approach-in-american-business-at-tesla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 Something else Tesla excels at. Worker injuries. One of the highest in all of the automakers. Maybe Tesla is too vertical? Falling off their own ladder? LOL! https://www.aol.com/article/finance/2017/05/24/teslas-hr-chief-is-out-after-claims-of-labor-violations-backed/22107829/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W. Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 (edited) First the title, Too many employees. My son in law had to give up working at Tesla due to a back injury caused be a bicycle accident. My grandson started working at Tesla several years ago. The last time I saw him was Thanksgiving last year, he looked totally exhausted (about to fall asleep at the dinner table) and I asked him why. He said they're short handed and he has been working 12 hour shifts for some time. I asked him if it was worth it and he showed me his pay check, a very nice number for only 2 weeks work. Edited June 16, 2017 by Ron W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 First the title, Too many employees. Too =also Get out your dictionary. Too is not only "also" and is correctly used in the title. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W. Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 My apologies, edited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Sounds like they need an ergonomics team to evaluate job tasks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Tesla is more vertically integrated than regular automakers. That decreases the vehicle per worker number. What other automakers rely on suppliers for, Tesla often does in-house. This makes Tesla the most "American" automaker. https://evannex.com/blogs/news/vertical-integration-how-elon-musk-employs-an-old-successful-approach-in-american-business-at-tesla American workers at the suppliers are less American than Tesla workers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 (edited) American workers at the suppliers are less American than Tesla workers? Not the American workers sir but many of the supplier firms themselves. Companies like Bosch, LG Chem, Denso, Magneti Marelli, etc. are not headquartered in the U.S. That makes them less "American" than U.S. based Tesla even though the supplier firms employ lots of American workers. Edited June 16, 2017 by rperez817 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 (edited) That makes them less "American" than U.S. based Tesla Doing everything themselves seems to be working out real well for them in terms of profits, quality, productivity and worker health. Edited June 16, 2017 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Doing everything themselves seems to be working out real well for them in terms of profits, quality, productivity and worker health. It has helped them become the largest U.S. automaker by market cap. Don't know when the bubble will burst! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Because market cap is a good measure of how strong a company is..... How about the fact that Ford alone sells more cars in one month than Tesla does in a year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Market cap is nothing more than what the public is willing to pay for the stock. It has very little bearing on the value of the company. If Tesla was sold off today, I seriously doubt it would fetch the numbers Ford would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 It has helped them become the largest U.S. automaker by market cap. Don't know when the bubble will burst! Do you, and I ask this in all seriousness, believe that market cap is a valuable measure of the health of a company? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Do you, and I ask this in all seriousness, believe that market cap is a valuable measure of the health of a company? By itself, no sir. Market cap is an important measure but only as a snapshot at a certain point in time. You have to consider other measures too in combination with market cap to understand a company's health. For example working capital to market cap ratio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 By itself, no sir. Market cap is an important measure but only as a snapshot at a certain point in time. You have to consider other measures too in combination with market cap to understand a company's health. For example working capital to market cap ratio. You're delusional. What was GMs market cap when they went bankrupt? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 By itself, no sir. Market cap is an important measure Enlighten me. Why is market cap an "important measure" of a company's health? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Books-a-Million https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast.com https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberian_Outpost https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EToys.com https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excite https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeoCities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Crossing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inktomi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/InfoSpace https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pets.com https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VerticalNet If you are not old enough to speak from experience, then you are advised to learn your history before posting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 You're delusional. No sir. It's not delusional to consider factors in addition to market cap when evaluating a business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 Enlighten me. Quote the rest of post 15 sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 Quote the rest of post 15 sir. I have read it. It does not explain why "market cap is an important measure." It's merely an assortment of other unsupported statements. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang_sallad Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 what would I have said back in 2012 if somebody told me that in 5 years, every thread about Tesla on this site would be half-filled with people reassuring themselves that Ford is probably still worth more than Tesla? It'd be really interesting to compare Tesla's manufacturing efficiency specifically to Ford's plug-in vehicles. I'm considering buying a Focus Electric (only thing holding me back is the trunk space) and it's taking its sweet time to work its way down the pipeline. Probably harder to compare since they share an assembly line with the other powertrains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 what would I have said back in 2012 if somebody told me that in 5 years, every thread about Tesla on this site would be half-filled with people reassuring themselves that Ford is probably still worth more than Tesla? We've been grouching about Ford's market cap since I signed up in like 2004. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 One company is making $8B profit annually, give or take. The other has never turned a profit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 (edited) As i understand it, market Cap is purely last trade value multiplied by number of shares. It says nothing to assets, profits, debts, current production and orders. in that respect, market Cap is absolutely zero guide to company health but 100% about investor sentiment regarding returns. I would sooner have Ford's market cap, quarterly profits and $28 Billion in cash and cash equivealents than Tesla's higher Market cap, main income from carbon credits and sale of new stock. Even Adam Jonas is coming to see that Tesla is selling little more than "Magic Beans", the rest of the market can't be too far behind... Edited June 18, 2017 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 (edited) Tesla's been sucking on Elon's teet for too long. If the Model 3 doesn't turn a profit, I see their stock price starting to slide down. Edited June 19, 2017 by 92merc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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