Jaguar Land Rover April 2017 US sales up 35%

[rperez817]

Free of Ford Motor Company ownership for 9 years, JLR is thriving in the US.

• Best ever Jaguar Land Rover U.S. April sales month at 8,441 units
• Best ever April sales month for Jaguar F-TYPE at 406 units
• Jaguar F-PACE, winner of two 2017 World Car of the Year Awards, volume leader for the month
• Best ever April sales month for Land Rover Discovery Sport at 928 units
• Second Best Land Rover April sales month driven by strong performance of Range Rover Evoque

http://media.jaguarlandrover.com/en-us/news/2017/05/jaguar-land-rover-reports-us-sales-april-2017

[sullynd]

Hey look, combined they came close to selling as many vehicles as Lincoln!

 

Didn't realize JLR numbers were that bad.

[rmc523]

I wish they'd put everything in tables like everyone else.

[tbone]

Hmm, seems like you are suggesting Ford wasn't a good steward of JLR.

[twintornados]

Free of Ford Motor Company ownership for 9 years, JLR is thriving in the US.

• Best ever Jaguar Land Rover U.S. April sales month at 8,441 units
• Best ever April sales month for Jaguar F-TYPE at 406 units
• Jaguar F-PACE, winner of two 2017 World Car of the Year Awards, volume leader for the month
• Best ever April sales month for Land Rover Discovery Sport at 928 units
• Second Best Land Rover April sales month driven by strong performance of Range Rover Evoque

.

T-Stag....is that you??

[rmc523]

Hmm, seems like you are suggesting Ford wasn't a good steward of JLR.

 

That's all he ever does. Ford does everything wrong and that's it, end of discussion.

Edited May 3, 2017 by rmc523

[RichardJensen]

Free of Ford Motor Company ownership for 9 years, JLR is thriving in the US.

 

We'll see how long it lasts.

 

Those volumes--even incorporating global sales--are insufficient to fund ongoing development at the pace with which BMW and Mercedes reinvest in their products. Therefore, as they have in the past, they will continue to need periodic cash injections from their parent company.

 

This is more or less indisputable and it is why Ford eventually sold them.

Edited May 3, 2017 by RichardJensen

[rperez817]

Hmm, seems like you are suggesting Ford wasn't a good steward of JLR.

 

Correct sir, Ford definitely wasn't a good steward of JLR. That's not my opinion though, it's fact. Alan Mulally acknowledged that Ford wasn't able to do a good job running luxury car brands. He said that JLR would thrive under a better steward, Tata Motors. JLR's growth since 2008 has proven Alan right!

Edited May 4, 2017 by rperez817

[fordtech1]

Ford did improve Jaguar quality. Tata got a Jaguar that was already set up to start an upward trend with an influx of cash. All that product that came out as soon as tata acquired them was in the pipeline​. Ford was like a person who has the budget to buy a big house but no budget to furnish it.

It was my understanding the Brits had a say in decision making. Similar to Saab and GM. Lot of disagreements.

[twintornados]

 

Correct sir, Ford definitely wasn't a good steward of JLR. That's not my opinion though, it's fact. Alan Mulally acknowledged that Ford wasn't able to do a good job running luxury car brands. He said that JLR would thrive under a better steward, Tata Motors. JLR's growth since 2008 has proven Alan right!

.

Wrong....what Alan acknowledged was Ford already had a luxury brand and they dumped the giant money pit called JLR to focus on what they already had, Lincolns turn around and growth since 2008 proved Alan was right.

[jpd80]

And Ford did everything it could to make sure that J/LR went to a good home

and that the owners would fund the prescribed product cycle - a condition of sale.

 

Let's also not forget that J/LR absolutely regfused every overture for Ford to intergrate

and had a huge dummy spit when Lincoln was given DEW, the LS was seen as a threat.

[RichardJensen]

 

Correct sir, Ford definitely wasn't a good steward of JLR. That's not my opinion though, it's fact.

 

No, Mr. Perez, that's a ​conclusion​.

 

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conclusion

Definition of conclusion for English Language Learners

• : a final decision or judgment : an opinion or decision that is formed after a period of thought or research

[RichardJensen]

Enjoy this helpful guide:

 

"I think I'm running a fever" - opinion

 

"Your temperature is 98.6" - fact

 

"You aren't running a fever" - conclusion

 

Is this conclusion a fact? No. It's a reasoned opinion.

 

What if the individual's homeostatic body temp was 97.2? Is the person then running a fever? Probably.

 

Facts are not the same as conclusions.

Edited May 4, 2017 by RichardJensen

[bzcat]

Ford sunk $2 billion in to JLR in a last ditch effort to change its fortune. The results of that investment was XF and XJ sedan, Evoque, and the 5.0 Jaguar V8 that salvaged Ranger Rover's reputation.

 

Ford left Tata a full line up of cars and SUV in development. The success of those models speaks for themselves.

[akirby]

Ford sunk $2 billion in to JLR in a last ditch effort to change its fortune. The results of that investment was XF and XJ sedan, Evoque, and the 5.0 Jaguar V8 that salvaged Ranger Rover's reputation.

 

Ford left Tata a full line up of cars and SUV in development. The success of those models speaks for themselves.

 

And Ford raised a little cash and avoided the big investment that would have been required for Jag/LR which allowed them to survive the recession without BK. I'd say that's a win/win. It certainly doesn't reflect badly on anything Ford did with them.

[jpd80]

And consider the same situation happened with Volvo, that brand was virtually run into the ground

covering the recurring losses of fellow PAG brands, Jaguar and Land Rover.

 

Funding the entire combined product cycle of those three btnds was in the order of $20 billion

at a time when Ford's own brand was still not secure and needed all of Ford resources and funding.

 

Had Ford kept Jaguar, Land Rover, Volvo and spent the required money to fund those product cycles,

it would have been waiting decades to see a return on that investment, both unreasonable and unwise

when that money was needed elsewhere...

 

The unseen part of the sale was the ten year engine supply contract which is now drawing to a close.

Edited May 5, 2017 by jpd80

[RichardJensen]

Had Ford kept Jaguar, Land Rover, Volvo and spent the required money to fund those product cycles,

it would have been waiting decades to see a return on that investment,

 

Arguably, they would never have seen a return on that investment. These marques don't self-fund. That's why they're not independent. Leaving them to do what they want their way means periodically throwing a few billion dollars at them.

[jpd80]

 

Arguably, they would never have seen a return on that investment. These marques don't self-fund. That's why they're not independent. Leaving them to do what they want their way means periodically throwing a few billion dollars at them.

and Ford simply could not afford to do that in its still weakened state.

 

I love how some revisionist views paint Ford in such a bad way, sure the prestige of owning Jaguar / Land Rover

is there but Ford wouldn't have deliberately curtailed any of J/LR's plans - they gave them plants, funding , paid for

warranty blunders ($450 million) and still get shit on for trying to keep the brands relevant, fresh and in safe keeping.

[twintornados]

 

Arguably, they would never have seen a return on that investment. These marques don't self-fund. That's why they're not independent. Leaving them to do what they want their way means periodically throwing a few billion dollars at them.

and Ford simply could not afford to do that in its still weakened state.

 

I love how some revisionist views paint Ford in such a bad way, sure the prestige of owning Jaguar / Land Rover

is there but Ford wouldn't have deliberately curtailed any of J/LR's plans - they gave them plants, funding , paid for

warranty blunders ($450 million) and still get shit on for trying to keep the brands relevant, fresh and in safe keeping.

.

Bottom line here is, J-LR was a dog with fleas and Ford was wise to dump them. They poured a ton of money into them and PAG turned into a bust that almost broke FoMoCo. Good riddance.

[jpd80]

.

Bottom line here is, J-LR was a dog with fleas and Ford was wise to dump them. They poured a ton of money into them and PAG turned into a bust that almost broke FoMoCo. Good riddance.

Jac Nasser's idea of turning Performance Auto Group into an income stream the size of Ford Europe

was predicated on Nasser's belief that the US market's total reliance on F Series and Explorer

would come under threat in the 2000s and another source of income was required.

 

Fiefdoms of the time prevented him for initiating the kinds of reforms initiated by Mulally six years later.

It's easy to criticize in hindsight but remember the Firestone-Explorer debacle was just gearing up,

lots of things happening at once.

 

Bottom line was instead of bringing much needed reform and clarity of business purpose,

Nasser grew Ford's business empire which in turn increased the need for more funding and

financial oversight. History now shows that it was the very opposite thing that Ford needed.

Edited May 6, 2017 by jpd80

[RichardJensen]

and Ford simply could not afford to do that in its still weakened state.

 

There isn't a point to it. Those multi-billion dollar periodic cash infusions occur because JLR are fundamentally unviable.

[sullynd]

 

There isn't a point to it. Those multi-billion dollar periodic cash infusions occur because JLR are fundamentally unviable.

But they sold OVER 400 F-TYPE!!! That's over 1/2 of 1% of F-Series sales!!!

[bzcat]

 

Arguably, they would never have seen a return on that investment. These marques don't self-fund. That's why they're not independent. Leaving them to do what they want their way means periodically throwing a few billion dollars at them.

 

Aston Martin and Jaguar definitely fit that description. I think Land Rover is debatable because the luxury SUV market was (and still is) headed upwards and Ford had more relevant core expertise in this area that luxury sedans or fancy sports cars.

 

I disagree about Volvo... that brand could have become self-funding if Ford really incorporated the entire operation within the Ford organization - i.e. sync up product cycle and consolidated production sites. Volvo's entire line up was FWD so it wouldn't require separate investments like JLR would have to fund new models. But given the dire financial situation the company was in, you can't fault Ford for selling it to generate some decent cash flow. Same with Mazda, which despite Ford being only an equity investor was actually far more integrated with Ford than Volvo was, which at the end, is really what was the problem with Volvo. too much deference to the Swedes on how to run the company. Notice that Geely had no problem telling Volvo to build cars in China to export it to the US... Ford couldn't even convince Volvo to build cars in Spain. Never mind the logical thinking that maybe XC90 should be build in the US with other D2 vehicles.

Edited May 8, 2017 by bzcat

[jpd80]

 

Aston Martin and Jaguar definitely fit that description. I think Land Rover is debatable because the luxury SUV market was (and still is) headed upwards and Ford had more relevant core expertise in this area that luxury sedans or fancy sports cars.

 

I disagree about Volvo... that brand could have become self-funding if Ford really incorporated the entire operation within the Ford organization - i.e. sync up product cycle and consolidated production sites. Volvo's entire line up was FWD so it wouldn't require separate investments like JLR would have to fund new models. But given the dire financial situation the company was in, you can't fault Ford for selling it to generate some decent cash flow. Same with Mazda, which despite Ford being only an equity investor was actually far more integrated with Ford than Volvo was, which at the end, is really what was the problem with Volvo. too much deference to the Swedes on how to run the company. Notice that Geely had no problem telling Volvo to build cars in China to export it to the US... Ford couldn't even convince Volvo to build cars in Spain. Never mind the logical thinking that maybe XC90 should be build in the US with other D2 vehicles.

Volvo's sale was a tragedy, it was the most integrated of all the brands and actually introduced CAN BUS to Ford.

During the 2000s, it was the chief back stop against all the red ink flowing form J/LR but unfortunately, it was

virtually run into the ground as a profit battery hen and given little in the way of fresh products, the S80 springs

to mind as the glaring exception.

 

Mazda gave Ford decent vehicle platforms at a time when most needed, that integration saved Ford a lot of money.

Ford only had the minimum possible share of for (about 30%) so not much risk and a lot of benefit form sharing.

Unfortunately, eyes turned inwards and Ford Europe was able to fill a lot of the needs previously covered by Mazda.

Edited May 9, 2017 by jpd80

[TStag]

Sorry I just read the ridiculous comment by Richard Jensen that JLR doesn't self fund! Really so how come they are driving TATA Motors profits, they have started making their own engines (dumping Ford's) and now have a 6 billion pound war chest to fund further growth?

 

Seriously the decision to keep the lights on at Lincoln and sell JLR was very dumb especially when Ford had already funded the turnaround with the XF, XJ and top selling Evoque. I said at the time it was very very dumb and have been proven right. Range Rover was always Fords most profitable brand (by margin) and Ford Europe bosses were dead against the sale because they knew what a dumb move Ford USA was making.

 

To say JLR doesn't self fund is insulting to TATA motors who clearly made one of the best moves ever in buying JLR!

 

Seriously don't ever listen to Richard Jensen again when he gives business advice, its right up there with Donald Trump. Who by the way would be way richer now if he'd just invested his inherited wealth in a tracker fund.....