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Tesla's cash burn raises concerns on Wall Street


jpd80

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If you rely on plugging in the vehicle to be able to drive it the next day, you're not going to forget.

Tell that to the 1/2 million people who ran out of gas last year.

I guess it is good they have some way to give you a bit of range

if you run out, but 10 miles would typically not get me home

in my area (many stores, like my local harbor freight, are well over

10 miles from my house), and I have one of the shorter commutes

@ 13 miles (woman commutes 47 miles, very common in NJ).

 

Problem becomes on any given day, I might head to a friends house

that is 40 miles south of me after work (I can't charge at work on

military base, a coworker tried several years ago with his Volt).

 

So if like many people, I pushed the edge and did not charge

(or get gas), because I thought I could make it the next day,

now I'd be stuck. Can get gas a million places along that 80

round trip.

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Tell that to the 1/2 million people who ran out of gas last year.

I guess it is good they have some way to give you a bit of range

if you run out, but 10 miles would typically not get me home

in my area (many stores, like my local harbor freight, are well over

10 miles from my house), and I have one of the shorter commutes

@ 13 miles (woman commutes 47 miles, very common in NJ).

 

Problem becomes on any given day, I might head to a friends house

that is 40 miles south of me after work (I can't charge at work on

military base, a coworker tried several years ago with his Volt).

 

So if like many people, I pushed the edge and did not charge

(or get gas), because I thought I could make it the next day,

now I'd be stuck. Can get gas a million places along that 80

round trip.

 

Electric is a different mindset. There is no point in 'thinking you could make it the next day'. Unlike getting gas, filling up on electric is not inconvenient. You just plug in when you pull in the garage or driveway. I mean, if I had an electric car, and I had a commute of 40 miles, or was going to a friends house of 40 miles, I would just plug in every day. Just the same as I plug my phone in every night, whether it is at 10% charge or 75% charge. It's just what I do.

 

The big drawback to an electric car is the longer-distance trips. An electric car would work perfect for my wife. She has a 50 mile round-trip commute and parks in the garage every night. However, having an electric car would limit the ability to take longer trips due to the hassle of needing to find a 'filling station' somewhere on that trip. Once electric 'filling stations' are more prevalent (I don't know of any in our area), it won't be an issue.

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Wrong. My son owns a Chevy Volt - plugs in every night - and at work. Rarely goes to a gas station. Lifetime average is over 150 mpg. Has a deposit on the Tesla model 3. In 5 years he has had 2 oil changes - zero issues. He will never go back to an ICE vehicle.

Just curious. Does his work charge him a fee to plug it in?

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Just curious. Does his work charge him a fee to plug it in?

 

They put in a charging station at my office but it was apparently done by a 3rd party. The cost to charge was ridiculous. I forgot exactly but I think I calculated it would cost something like $8-$10 for 50 miles worth of range. Far more expensive than gasoline. I don't think I've ever seen anyone charging their vehicles there.

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One of my clients recently put in a new charging station. I don't believe they charge for it. It's located about 300 yards from the reactor churning out 1200 MW of nuclear-fueled electricity. :)

 

The company's headquarters also has a charging station, as well as a fleet of Leafs (Leaves?) and Volts that employees can sign out for a day.

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Electric is a different mindset. There is no point in 'thinking you could make it the next day'. Unlike getting gas, filling up on electric is not inconvenient. You just plug in when you pull in the garage or driveway. I mean, if I had an electric car, and I had a commute of 40 miles, or was going to a friends house of 40 miles, I would just plug in every day. Just the same as I plug my phone in every night, whether it is at 10% charge or 75% charge. It's just what I do.

 

The big drawback to an electric car is the longer-distance trips. An electric car would work perfect for my wife. She has a 50 mile round-trip commute and parks in the garage every night. However, having an electric car would limit the ability to take longer trips due to the hassle of needing to find a 'filling station' somewhere on that trip. Once electric 'filling stations' are more prevalent (I don't know of any in our area), it won't be an issue.

 

Exactly - as I said above, it would become a habit to just plug it in every night.

 

Charging times and locations are decreasing and increasing, respectively, as the technology gets better and more widespread. Sure, there aren't charging stations all over like there are gas stations right now, and really, they won't be convenient for most people at the moment, given how long it takes to charge right now (you can't stop for >5 minutes to fill up like you can with a gas station) - it's more of a 'stop, stretch, shop, etc' thing right now, but over time, we'll continue to see them pop up, though I think the home-based charging will still be the primary form of charging for most electric car buyers, even when "stations" do become more widespread.....why would I go park my car at some charging station when I could just do it at home? Unless I absolutely had to or was on a trip, I wouldn't.

 

For trips, Tesla's navigation system will set routes that take you through Supercharger locations. My commute sounds similar to your wife's - it's 60 miles total (30 there, 30 back), and I've thought about electric, though the range of anything non-Tesla (and not 75K+) at the moment hasn't seemed realistic for my uses. The Model 3 certainly is intriguing. I'm also by extension interested in the Model E....and Bronco ;)

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The mistake is thinking that an electric car driver will behave the same as an ICE driver.

 

Right - the nature of current electric cars almost necessitate that. Not to mention early adopters are more likely to be "into" the whole electric "experience" meaning their more ready for a change from the routine of fueling an ICE car.

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You just plug in when you pull in the garage or driveway. I mean, if I had an electric car, and I had a commute of 40 miles, or was going to a friends house of 40 miles, I would just plug in every day. Just the same as I plug my phone in every night, whether it is at 10% charge or 75% charge. It's just what I do.

 

 

I guess I am the only one who sometimes forgets to plug in their phone at night. But that I can charge from my IC car, at work,

in the middle of an airport. Not really comparable.

 

Then don't buy an electric car

 

Problem solved

 

Probably won't. But lets look at it.

 

What is the cost of the cheapest AWD electric car. I love my AWD, even in the rain. Got my 15 fusion for $23,200 from Koons ford in Va (almsot $6500 off sticker). Lets assume you managed to get an AWD Tesla3 for $35K after rebates and whatnot (smokin discount I'd guess since base 2WD is supposed to be $35K, but I'm assuming somone will get as good a deal somehow that I got on my fusion).

 

Thats still 12 grand (plus tax, so say $12,800) in fuel costs and oil changes I have to make back up. Will an AWD Tesla be faster than my Fusion, probably, but a tune, DP, and IC puts my 4 banger in the high 13's, so plenty fast for a daily.

 

Lets deduct 2 grand for my fusion for go fast parts, still need to overcome $10.8 grand. I spend about $1800 year in gas, lets say an electric driven very spiritedly uses $800 (I've seen $540/yr thrown around, but that would not be me). Oil changes, 35$ every 6K, so that is $600 over 100K miles (do them myself).

 

So we are down to $10.2 grand. So about $1000 a year savings on fuel , or a 9-10 year payback. @ 100K miles. Do we have to do batteries in electric, most modern IC cars need nothing @ 100K (brakes tires, but assuming Tesla needs those also??).

 

One could argue Telsa gets you gadgets I didn't get. Don't care, want to drive my car myself, don't need laptop size screen on my dash to distract me even more. My car is pretty loaded with turbo, AWD, all power and seats, decent stereo, 18" wheels with decent rubber, etc...

 

So right now I don't see it financially and that is before all the hassle of long re-charge times and/or lack on charging infrastructure.

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Oh for pete's sake - nobody is telling you to buy one, so DON'T BUY ONE!

 

But that doesn't mean others shouldn't buy one if they want it.

 

 

They can do whatever they want and I can point out they are wasting money if I want.

Unless there is some rule on this message board that we can't have that conversation.

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They can do whatever they want and I can point out they are wasting money if I want.

Unless there is some rule on this message board that we can't have that conversation.

 

You didn't say that originally, you said people would forget to plug it in.

 

You need to grasp the difference between saying what you like or don't like and saying what other people should or shouldn't do.

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I guess I am the only one who sometimes forgets to plug in their phone at night. But that I can charge from my IC car, at work,

in the middle of an airport. Not really comparable.

 

Have you ever run out of gas? If so, how many times have you forgotten to get gas after that? If not, chances are you won't forget to plug your car in since you have to use it to get to work (or wherever else you may go). Sure, a phone may not be comparable as far as importance, but it's a habit you will learn. Using forgetting to plug it in as a reason not to have an electric car is about as lame as you can get. There are plenty other reasons (cost for one, range for another), but don't make it sound like forgetting to plug it in is a showstopper.

 

So dont buy one.

 

Exactly!

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My feeling is that the few extra minutes you might have to spend waiting for a recharge on an occasional long road trip would be an acceptable trade off for all the minutes I save by not having to make routine stops at gas stations the rest of the year.

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