T-bird Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Looks like Mark Fields is serious about Linclon. http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/24/us-fordmotor-lincoln-idUSKCN0ID2FU20141024?feedType=RSS&feedName=businessNews 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 I think the simple explanation is that Ford is now a much healthier company than they were under Mulally's tenure. And by that I mean that Mulally rightly had the company focus on the Ford brand and getting it healthy, while Lincoln was on the back burner. Now that the company is healthier, they can devote more appropriate resources to the Lincoln brand since the Ford brand is set with new products. I do believe that even if Mulally had stayed, we would've seen more investment in Lincoln, so I don't mean my comments to be a criticism of him, just that the circumstances are different now for Fields, allowing him to do this. And D6 platform, eh? Hmmm.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 That article is not, net, a reducer of questions about Lincoln--it raises about as many as it answers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 I think the simple explanation is that Ford is now a much healthier company than they were under Mulally's tenure. And by that I mean that Mulally rightly had the company focus on the Ford brand and getting it healthy, while Lincoln was on the back burner. Now that the company is healthier, they can devote more appropriate resources to the Lincoln brand since the Ford brand is set with new products. I do believe that even if Mulally had stayed, we would've seen more investment in Lincoln, so I don't mean my comments to be a criticism of him, just that the circumstances are different now for Fields, allowing him to do this. And D6 platform, eh? Hmmm.... you basically said what ive been harping all along, strengthen the core forst..THEN branch out. I also queried ( on the RWD thread ) why underpinnings couldnt mimic what Fords Transit is capable of...FWD, RWD and AWD, all on the SAME platform..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 That article is not, net, a reducer of questions about Lincoln--it raises about as many as it answers. if wallets get loosened, I cant wait...theres no doubt in my mind Lincoln could become a major player...hell, theyve already had jaguar, Lond Rover and Aston...not to mention Volvo so i would guess the expertise is there, but until now they have been held back by beancounters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 FWD and RWD on the "same" platform, methinks, stretches the definition of "platform" beyond even Volkswagenian dimensions. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 held back by beancounters. Those 'beancounters' kept Ford out of chapter 11. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Those 'beancounters' kept Ford out of chapter 11. not doubting that in the slightest....glad they did, but is now the time to open the wallets now the company is now fiscally stable? Id say yes...exciting as hell... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 FWD and RWD on the "same" platform, methinks, stretches the definition of "platform" beyond even Volkswagenian dimensions. serious brainstorming...constraint free...could be game changing.....Im impressed with the Z, C and upcoming X right now, and those are built to guidelines ( ie Fusion, Escape, and Edge ) now it seems, reading between the lines there may be more freedom to think outside the box.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 You can't be 'constraint free', though. You've got front wheels, a transmission, an engine, a firewall and they all have to fit together. Organizing those bits for FWD & RWD is very different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) You can't be 'constraint free', though. You've got front wheels, a transmission, an engine, a firewall and they all have to fit together. Organizing those bits for FWD & RWD is very different. Im no engineer in the slightest, so I cant offer my input as to how, but the ingenuity shown with having such an adaptable platform in the Euro transit intrigues the heck out of me, and it would be incredible if they could somehow do the same in a regular SUV/ CUV and or/ sedan platform...gloves are off...Im jazzed, because ULTIMATELY I would expect soem trickle down to Ford....my miondset may be overly simplistic, but IMO one of lincolns biggest hurdles has been budgetary constraints...its like having a black and white palette and all of a sudden being told you can add color... Edited October 24, 2014 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfan Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 If this platform is exclusive to Lincoln, hopefully this will mean Lincoln will build its own plant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 If this platform is exclusive to Lincoln, hopefully this will mean Lincoln will build its own plant. necessary?....or a waste of resources that could be used to develop more product?.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 such an adaptable platform in the Euro transit Do you want a luxury sedan that looks like a van? :D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Let's see how that panel-shaping technology that Ford has shown develops. For low-production top hat variation, IMHO, it offers possibilities, no dies required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 That article is not, net, a reducer of questions about Lincoln--it raises about as many as it answers. Well, we now know the platform code is D6, and it is drive wheel agnostic like Audi's MLB platform... We didn't know that before. We also now know that CD4 MKS will definitely spawn a LWB version. Previously that was just an educated guess. $5 billion over 5 years is actually a pretty reasonable amount of money if it includes this bespoke Lincoln D6 platform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Okay, Seems likely that Ford would definitely copy Audi on this one, with an AWD transaxle sending the output shafts below the torque converter, placing the engine in front of the axle center line. My question is this: Would Ford adapt the FWD transfer case to sit directly behind the transaxle, making use of the transmission doghouse in the floorpan? You'd definitely have to do different front subframes and crash mitigation, but I'm curious if you could share the firewall and floorpan by strategic relocation of the transfer case.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Well, we now know the platform code is D6, and it is drive wheel agnostic like Audi's MLB platform... We didn't know that before. We also now know that CD4 MKS will definitely spawn a LWB version. Previously that was just an educated guess. $5 billion over 5 years is actually a pretty reasonable amount of money if it includes this bespoke Lincoln D6 platform. It's not bespoke - it will be shared by Ford too. My guess is Ford gets the FWD versions although I'm still trying to figure out why you'd bother. This might also explain the "no new Taurus" comment. This platform would obviously replace D3/D4. A RWD/AWD premium platform shared between Lincoln and Ford? Preposterous........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 (edited) I think if D6 has longitude engine placement, a lot of packaging issue for FWD based Explorer can be solved without adding significant costs or complexity. In the other thread, we basically assumed the choice was between FWD transverse (CD4+) or bespoke RWD - I don't think we contemplated this hybrid option. If you do Explorer FWD with longitude engine, you can still share the platform with something that is RWD (say Lincoln Continental). Things like transmission can still be shared, and suspension designs and sub-frames can be accommodated for different applications. Audi's MLB platform is set up like this. You can make it FWD or you can make it RWD if you add a driveshaft. Audi doesn't currently make any RWD only version but it is technically feasible. Edited October 25, 2014 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 (edited) Also, this is not the early 2000s when Ford was in a different place with BOF Explorer, Sport Track & Crown Vic as well as D3s like the Five Hundred, Freestyle as well as DN101. Ford has reduced platform count and is much more more concise in supplier count. Reductions like that also allow new visions on which directions are needed to grow the company's portfolio. While the choice was made to use existing FWD/AWDs over developing a global RWD/AWD architecture based on the Aussie Falcon/Territory and inclusive of the Mustang's RWD needs, I think where Ford is now could give rise to newer RWD/AWDs that suit a changed product envelope, Ford has had time to work out which vehicles are really needed and why. Is a RWD/AWD 3-row utility needed, does Ford need a RWD sedan as well as Mustang or would a 2-door coupe /4-door coupe based on Mustang suffice? What role will light weighting play in all of this, would those vehicles stay unitary construction or switch to Aluminum body and say, a magnesium frame - would that ultimately give Ford more flexibility with selection of different drive arrangements? Lots of questions, most probably based on market trends and company goals - will "Ford" become a Premium brand in order to elevate Lincoln and if that was done, is there opportunity for another brand to group different buyer demographic? I don't think that article actually addresses anything more than a future vision in five years time, something that could well be long forgotten by the time we reach that point and other financial considerations take hold. Developing a luxury brand and giving ti a full showroom of vehicles is wickedly expensive, would China sales help justify that or is the heavy lifting down to improving Ford brand products and platforms to a more premium role. Edited October 25, 2014 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 (edited) If you do Explorer FWD with longitude engine. That would make the most sense. Primary cost diff between transverse and longitudinal layout then becomes--seemingly--a bigger transmission housing, and an output shaft and gears that take the output from the back of the transmission up to the differential. That seems small enough to be more than made up by additional Lincoln volume.... Edited October 25, 2014 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 (edited) Here's the latest Audi setup: This shows the Quattro system. A FWD only setup would be fairly similar for much of the length, but the back end would be, basically, a pair of gears spinning the output shaft that runs toward the front-mounted differential. Below, the FWD transmission, note the 'snub' end and lack of an output shaft to the rear, as well as the nearside bulge for the output shaft running toward the differential at the front of the transmission: I'm quite curious to see if Ford jointly engineers their own variant w/ZF (or BW) in order to incorporate their own AWD systems. Edited October 25, 2014 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseodiaga4 Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 If this platform is exclusive to Lincoln, hopefully this will mean Lincoln will build its own plant. not sure if a own plant is necessary but a unique platform is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 not sure if a own plant is necessary but a unique platform is! You don't need a unique platform - just the right platform. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 This would seem like all part of the plan to convince the Ford Family that killing off Mercury was the right thing to do...both marquees (Lincoln and Mercury) were a direct result of Edsel Fords' influence on the Ford Motor Company while he was alive and actively involved in the companies operations. When FoMoCo discontinued Mercury, I was shocked that "The Family" would allow it, Mercury was unlike any of the other brands Ford owned...it was created by Edsel himself as a step from the bare bones Fords of the era to eventually bring the buyer into the realm of Lincoln which he oversaw as Lincoln was also his "baby", having purchased the luxury brand from Henry Leyland in 1922...his vision then is the vision of Lincoln Motor Company now....create vehicles on par with the best vehicles produced in the world.....after all the distractions, and false starts, it would seem that Lincoln Motor Company, the brand that was closest to Edsel Ford himself is finally getting her due....all with the blessing of "The Family" that has always held Edsel in sacred regard....his vision lives on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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