MAJOR CONCERN/ISSUE WITH 2014 FORD EXPLORER SPORT

[coupe3w]

Is there an issue with the ecoboost engines or not? Seams like there is. Does Ford have a fix that works yet? Just want to know what Ford is doing to address the problem.

[Kev-Mo]

MikeyD

Unless FordTech or one of the other professionals chime in here, you won't get any real solutions - mostly guess work. You might want to seek him out and e-mail him directly using that member functionality. He has helped me that way in the past. This forum is generally discussion oriented, not tech help.

 

Check out this site, and this thread in particular. They are discussing your very same issue with 2014 Ecoboost Explorer and mentioning Oxygen Sensors as a solution.

Serious Explorations:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3250231

 

By the way - I support your urgency and actions. Seems the entire world is so urgent to take your $40k, but when it comes to patience, it all rests on the customer. I hope your problems are resolved quickly.

 

Just my 2 cents - all my Fords have generally run great for the duration of their existence, but by the seat of my pants I always seem to feel some very brief performance issues (like hesitation) twice a year as gas blends are seasonally changed - not sure if this is a NoCal regulation but it happens like clockwork in spring and fall in Colorado. My guess work - take if for what it is worth.

[NickF1011]

Is there an issue with the ecoboost engines or not? Seams like there is. Does Ford have a fix that works yet? Just want to know what Ford is doing to address the problem.

 

From what I recall, Ford has redesigned the intercooler on the newer EcoBoost engines. Not sure if it's a solution that can be retrofitted to the existing engines though -- I would think not. I think other fixes have been developed to mitigate most of the problem though.

[fordtech1]

I am sorry to hear you are having this problem with your new explorer. I doubt water condensation in the intercooler is an issue. The main ecoboost with what issue was F150s. That issue was mainly on heavy accel magnified during high humid conditions and extended highway driving.

 

At any rate, the 3.5 ecoboost in MKS/Taurus/Flex/Exp have been very trouble free. Some early build spark plug cracking was noted. Here is what I suggest if the dealer can not duplicate it. I would ask the dealer to install the Vehicle data recorder in your vehicle so next time this happens, you press a pendant button to record all the events 10 seconds before you pressed the button and 20 seconds after.

 

I had a 2010 Eco Flex with a customer that had a very intermittent concern. She said it felt like the vehicle was struck from behind at times. I drove it 100 miles and never verified it. I sent it out with a VDR and she came back with 3 recordings. Turned out to be a transmission sensor that was going from 6th to 1st to 6th in a split second. At any rate, concern was fixed and she was happy.

 

Send me your VIN and I will do some looking for any other reports.

Edited April 3, 2014 by fordtech1

[coupe3w]

I am sorry to hear you are having this problem with your new explorer. I doubt water condensation in the intercooler is an issue. The main ecoboost with what issue was F150s. That issue was mainly on heavy accel magnified during high humid conditions and extended highway driving.

 

At any rate, the 3.5 ecoboost in MKS/Taurus/Flex/Exp have been very trouble free. Some early build spark plug cracking was noted. Here is what I suggest if the dealer can not duplicate it. I would ask the dealer to install the Vehicle data recorder in your vehicle so next time this happens, you press a pendant button to record all the events 20 seconds before you pressed the button and 10 seconds after.

 

I had a 2010 Eco Flex with a customer that had a very intermittent concern. She said it felt like the vehicle was struck from behind at times. I drove it 100 miles and never verified it. I sent it out with a VDR and she came back with 3 recordings. Turned out to be a transmission sensor that was going from 6th to 1st to 6th in a split second. At any rate, concern was fixed and she was happy.

 

Send me your VIN and I will do some looking for any other reports.

 

This is the type of response I like to here. I don't understand why all service departments wouldn't offer this vehicle data recorder on all intermittent complaints. Seems like this could solve a lot of problems the first time. But what do I know.

[fordtech1]

The reason the VDR is a last resort tool is because of two things. 1. The original VDR is expensive and if it leaves and never comes back then the dealer is out a lot of money. Some make people leave a credit card number, but warranty customers don't like that. 2. The new version is the VCMII which is the communication module that is used between the PC and the car. With it used as a VDR, the dealer is down one scan tool. It too is very expensive.

 

There is a saying you will hear on our side of the business, "The VDR has fixed more cars....". Meaning, once the VDR is installed it never seems to be recorded/recreated by the customer.

[fordtech1]

One more thing I meant to chime in on that was discussed. Ecoboost Intercooler condensation issue. It has only been reported on F150s. The intercoolers have been redesigned with a dryer and purge valve on 2013+ models. The latest TSB for 2011-2012 model F150s they are blocking the air from the lower approx. 5 rows of the intercooler to warm up the bottom to help with condensation. The intercooler was too efficient cooling air too much creating condensation in humid conditions at highway speeds. Then when boost was created under heavy accel the moisture was ingested causing misfires. This issue has really been reduced from when it first came out. I think there some vehicles that can have this problem, but the latest TSB has dramatically dropped complaints.

That issue was confused with spark plug issues on the F150 also. We are seeing these spark plugs causing random misfires at 60k miles. The plugs must be gapped correctly due to the fact of force induction. My personal recommendation on F150s is replace plugs at 60k. Easy to do, and don't cost near what 5.4 3V plugs did. Full retail price will be at least half of what a 5.4 3v cost. Also, no worries of breaking.

 

If you own a 3.5 Ecoboost F150 and you have greater than 50k miles and have some misfires under WOT (wide open throttle) or heavy accel. Replace all 6 spark plugs before spending any money on anything else.

[RichardJensen]

The reason the VDR is a last resort tool is because of two things.

 

Does the VDR record anything aside from the OBDII stuff? I would've thought that a device that carries a 10 second cache, with a 30 second capacity and just monitors OBD stuff would be pretty cheap.

[fordtech1]

Yes it is selectable to what it records. You can set up what module and which PIDS (parameter identification data) you want to record. Standard OBDII data is not enough. I am sure some aftermarket VDRs are out there and do as much, possibly more. I am just not familiar.

 

Everytime I have used a standard OBD scanner to get basic data that was stored with a code the information is very limited.

[RichardJensen]

That makes sense.

[YT90SC]

The VDR concept has been around for a very long time. The original launched with SBDS in/around 1990. It monitored EEC IV systems, and started to do limited EECV / OBDII. (I own and operate a FUCNTIONAL SBDS). The current VDR came out with the now defunct WDS. It can monitor almost any function that IDS can with enough refresh rate to actually capture an intermittent fault. VDR's update rate is actually faster than most update rates of all but the highest end aftermarket scan tools, let alone recorders. I've never seen an aftermarket reverse engineered device that could come close to doing what a VDR can.

VDR costs can be attributed to a small run (not every dealer even bought ONE) of highly capable purpose built systems. I don't remember who contracted them, but it was not cheap. It is also older technology that cost more at the time than current does. Scan tools were the same. When my SBDS was new it was specifically contracted through HP, cost $50,000 and was limited by its "286" and "386" processors. It is huge and even the portable part is heavy and very cumbersome. WDS was smaller and faster and covered all the items that IDS now does, but was non upgradeable a total turd. (WDS's official name was Worldwide Diagnostic System though it earned the name Wont Do Sh!t in the service bays as it was ultra unreliable) Most WDS's died before IDS was available to take its place. But it could be bought for around $12,000 for a fully optioned system. The VCMII can be bought for around $900 plus laptop and software license, and is upgradeable. (Which one may note was cheaper than the NGS was) Optional VMM brings a 4 channel lab scope to play too.

 

As Fordtech said, we have to protect them and not hand them out all willy nilly. They are out of production and therefore cannot be readily replaced. The new VCM II is too valuable as a primary scan tool to allow it to be out as a VDR. Most dealerships don't own their VCMII's as that burden has shifted to the individual tech. Under warranty it is nearly impossible for the tech to get paid for all of his time to install them and/or read data off of them. Also as Fordtech said, so many times a customer CANNOT duplicate the concern even with the VDR installed.. or if they do make recordings they are crap cause the customer has tried to anticipate the issue and recorded nothing but normal function... or the customer swears its a transmission issue when it isn't so the tech concentrates on a trans issue and the problem is not caught cause the PIDs that are recorded are transmission and not say.. fuel pressure... or the problem occurred one time in 15k miles several months ago... or... or... or... A VDR is usually a last resort or given to a customer whom we know we will get it back from, when there is a good probability that the problem can be caught.

[goinbroke2]

And yet the general consensus with the population is mechanic's are greasy parts changers, "cooter" off of dukes of hazzard.

 

Sorry, pet peeve of mine.

 

"it cost how much? mechanic's are just ripping me off, they're crooks, etc. Or my other favourite..."well if you don't go to college you'll end up a mechanic or some other uneducated trade".

[fordtech1]

The VDR concept has been around for a very long time. The original launched with SBDS in/around 1990. It monitored EEC IV systems, and started to do limited EECV / OBDII. (I own and operate a FUCNTIONAL SBDS). The current VDR came out with the now defunct WDS. It can monitor almost any function that IDS can with enough refresh rate to actually capture an intermittent fault. VDR's update rate is actually faster than most update rates of all but the highest end aftermarket scan tools, let alone recorders. I've never seen an aftermarket reverse engineered device that could come close to doing what a VDR can.

VDR costs can be attributed to a small run (not every dealer even bought ONE) of highly capable purpose built systems. I don't remember who contracted them, but it was not cheap. It is also older technology that cost more at the time than current does. Scan tools were the same. When my SBDS was new it was specifically contracted through HP, cost $50,000 and was limited by its "286" and "386" processors. It is huge and even the portable part is heavy and very cumbersome. WDS was smaller and faster and covered all the items that IDS now does, but was non upgradeable a total turd. (WDS's official name was Worldwide Diagnostic System though it earned the name Wont Do Sh!t in the service bays as it was ultra unreliable) Most WDS's died before IDS was available to take its place. But it could be bought for around $12,000 for a fully optioned system. The VCMII can be bought for around $900 plus laptop and software license, and is upgradeable. (Which one may note was cheaper than the NGS was) Optional VMM brings a 4 channel lab scope to play too.

 

As Fordtech said, we have to protect them and not hand them out all willy nilly. They are out of production and therefore cannot be readily replaced. The new VCM II is too valuable as a primary scan tool to allow it to be out as a VDR. Most dealerships don't own their VCMII's as that burden has shifted to the individual tech. Under warranty it is nearly impossible for the tech to get paid for all of his time to install them and/or read data off of them. Also as Fordtech said, so many times a customer CANNOT duplicate the concern even with the VDR installed.. or if they do make recordings they are crap cause the customer has tried to anticipate the issue and recorded nothing but normal function... or the customer swears its a transmission issue when it isn't so the tech concentrates on a trans issue and the problem is not caught cause the PIDs that are recorded are transmission and not say.. fuel pressure... or the problem occurred one time in 15k miles several months ago... or... or... or... A VDR is usually a last resort or given to a customer whom we know we will get it back from, when there is a good probability that the problem can be caught.

 

Man to own a operational SBDS is priceless. Do you know how many times I could have used SBDS on some old EEC IV stuff recently. Pre 1993 NGS (which I still have) can not look at pids or do much other than run KOEO/KOER. SBDS was the s*it in its day. We have one and would like to have it fixed but the one company that used to refurbish them is out of business.

 

One gripe I have with Ford is they are so fast to stop supporting vehicles. I had at the time a 6 year old Lincoln LS with a IC that was bad. Part was obsolete. I finally pitched a bitch so bad with PACO and our FSE and hotline, I got a call from a electronics engineer from Dearborn. He told me to get a good used cluster and send it to him, he would program the mileage and certify it and send it back. It seems like after 5-6 years stuff goes obsolete so fast.

Edited April 4, 2014 by fordtech1

[saintlaz1]

 

This is now becoming a HUGE concern for me as I have 2 young daughters and a wife to worry about a

 

So this would not be a problem if you were single with no kids?

[fordmantpw]

So this would not be a problem if you were single with no kids?

 

It would be a BIG problem if he was single with no kids. It is a HUGE problem with a wife and 2 kids.

 

I understood, as I'm sure most parents would.

[saintlaz1]

 

It would be a BIG problem if he was single with no kids. It is a HUGE problem with a wife and 2 kids.

 

I understood, as I'm sure most parents would.

Its more that this is a moot point. that's all i was trying to say.the problem isn't any bigger because certain people are in a car. Its like a baby on board sign, its not that i had an option whether to hit you or not, its going to happen with or without the sign.

Edited April 4, 2014 by saintlaz1

[fordmantpw]

Its more that this is a moot point. the problem isn't any bigger because certain people are in a car. Its like a baby on board sign, its not that i had an option whether to hit you or not, its going to happen with or without the sign.

 

You obviously don't get it, so I'm not going to waste any more bandwidth trying to explain it to you.

[BrewfanGRB]

 

You obviously don't get it, so I'm not going to waste any more bandwidth trying to explain it to you.

 

I get it, but I also get his point. The problem is he (Saintlaz) is trying to apply logic where it's not used in the handling of the situation. If it was, one would evaluate the issue based on its relative severity, the inconvenience, the likelihood of failure, etc. It either IS or IS NOT a problem of X magnitude. But with spouses and kids, rationality and logic are out the window. Not saying that's WRONG, just that the OP's actions here are driven by love, not logic.

[blwnsmoke]

 

Not saying that's WRONG, just that the OP's actions here are driven by love, not logic.

 

Love this, stated perfectly!! That's why I posted about filing a NHTSA complaint before giving Ford a chance to fix is ridiculous. Being on the Explorer forum for 3 years, I've not read this issue (besides the CAC blowing off but that's a separate issue) and it seems to be a 1 off issue, maybe 2. Why file a complaint on something (I know it doesn't work like the BBB) before any manufacturer has had a chance to fix the issue. Love, not logic.

[Extreme4x4]

2013 Explorer Sport with 22K miles and no issues at all.

 

From what I have witnessed, these engines are incredibly reliable in these vehicles. It is unfortunate that you are having an issue with yours, but am glad that you still love the vehicle, and are giving Ford a chance.

 

As someone who used to own and work in our Auto Repair and towing business, intermittent problems are a nightmare to diagnose. As FordTech said, the recorder should be able to show what is or isn't happening, when it happens, which will lead to a fix. This will also be recorded by Ford to help diagnose any others that have this issue in the future.

 

Enjoy your Sport, especially the admiring glances. She will be fixed. We certainly love our HOTSOSS.

[MikeyD]

Well ladies and gentleman.......It's D-Day....this Wednesday 5/7/2014 will be 30 days that my 2014 Explorer with 3500 miles on it has been in the shop. And according to Ford there is no estimate....zero...nothing....nada on when the new fan design will be ready to ship out !!!! So I might not even see this thing for another month or 2!!! Also don't forget this isn't even looking at the main issue regarding the vehicle practically stalling on me.

Unfortunately I've spoken with the Ford Regional manager that I've been working with and I've been kind and patient but to be honest with you making a full months payment on a car that I don't even have kinds of gets under my skin.

Sooooo on that note when I spoke to the Regional Manager I told him I think I'm ready to file for a Lemon Law buy back. I really do enjoy my 2014 Explorer Sport, so I think I might give it another go....I just think there is a major issue with the one I have that they cannot resolve. So the Regional Manager said he would call me back tomorrow on how it will all work and it usually take 15 days average to get full response from Ford on what they will do.

To be honest I'm on the fence because my car is somewhat still new and I'm not sure if I can get as good as a deal if I get a new one (incentives wise).

I'll update all when I hear back.

[Hydro]

I believe you can stop making payments on it. Man, I'm so bummed for you. I hope they work hard to make you happy. Glad to hear you're taking this pretty well.

[Marginal Economist]

Sorry for the issue - who are you dealing with in Sacramento? Dealership and Ford personnel?

 

Also, don't not make a payment - not worth the credit hit risk.

[fordmantpw]

Also, don't not make a payment - not worth the credit hit risk.

 

Agreed! It could easily cost you more than that payment in higher interest on your next purchase.

[akirby]

Yes - don't confuse vehicle issues with financing. Ford credit is just like a bank and you owe them the payment regardless of the vehicle condition or circumstances. If you can get Ford to make the payment for you that's fine, but you can't skip a payment.