Fallout: Massacre @ Cinema 9

[TomServo92]

And I guarentee you that not a single one of them would try this in The great state of Texas.

 

I own several guns and I carry a concealed handgun and a tactical knife 90% of the time. I do not support the NRA. They're kind of like greenpiece to the environmentalist movement, embarassing.

 

I am open to more stringent regulations on hi- capacity magazines and the online sale of tactical gear.

 

In Texas also. Not yet a concealed handgun carrier but my wife and will be soon. We are both ardent believers in the right to self-defense.

[Versa-Tech]

Slippery slope........check out Chicago and DC to see how successful stringent gun law are

Yeah, and the sky is falling. You can't base every decision you make on an assumption of catastrophic escalation. If and when the anarchists try to ban guns altogether, we deal with it then.

[napfirst]

Regulations -- not all out bans.

And this will prevent what happened in Co.............how?.......you don't think that "evil" people won't find a way?......so we make it harder with more regs...it happens again and then the "regulators" say " we need more regulation"..>>>>slippery slope.......I was watching the news this morning and the mayor of NYC wants to regulate 16oz. sodas....first it was trans-fat...now soda...we arre turing into a nanny state

[napfirst]

Yeah, and the sky is falling. You can't base every decision you make on an assumption of catastrophic escalation. If and when the anarchists try to ban guns altogether, we deal with it then.

Famous last words..."we'll deal with it then"......I agree on making assumptions on catastrophic escalation...just like the recent catastrophic escatation in Aurora Co.

[Versa-Tech]

Famous last words..."we'll deal with it then"......I agree on making assumptions on catastrophic escalation...just like the recent catastrophic escatation in Aurora Co.

What escalation are you refering to?

[Versa-Tech]

And this will prevent what happened in Co.............how?.......you don't think that "evil" people won't find a way?......so we make it harder with more regs...it happens again and then the "regulators" say " we need more regulation"..>>>>slippery slope.......I was watching the news this morning and the mayor of NYC wants to regulate 16oz. sodas....first it was trans-fat...now soda...we arre turing into a nanny state

That happened months ago. Are you sure you haven't slipped into a time warp?

[cal50]

Regulations -- not all out bans.

 

Not an outright ban but taxing or regulating it out of reach for the majority of people is the same result.

This is a key point in states that have a "shall issue" CHL permit or a discretionary issuance.

 

 

Back in time 1930's to the mid 60's you had increased availability of firearms, explosives and many other nasty items from you local hardware store and few social problems with people that abused it. Today you have higher prices, more regulation and decreased availability of those same item and more problems. Regulation only drive up the cost or makes the legal and determined user wait. It does zero for the social reject that will either buy or steal the items they want to do harm.

[NickF1011]

And this will prevent what happened in Co.............how?.......you don't think that "evil" people won't find a way?......so we make it harder with more regs...it happens again and then the "regulators" say " we need more regulation"..>>>>slippery slope.......I was watching the news this morning and the mayor of NYC wants to regulate 16oz. sodas....first it was trans-fat...now soda...we arre turing into a nanny state

 

I don't recall saying regulations would have prevented anything. The slippery slope argument only holds weight where there is proof of it occurring. If anything, the rules for gun regulation seem to be swinging back the other way as laws such as the DC handgun ban have been overturned. Checks and balances. They usually work.

[Langston Hughes]

Slippery slope........check out Chicago and DC to see how successful stringent gun law are

Regulations -- not all out bans.

 

Slippery slope is a logical fallacy and not a true point of debate. You have to make assumptions that an unknown amount of variables will all fall into place, which is highly unlikely. It's been called the alphabet argument because anyone making a slippery slope argument would need to suggest with high probability that the entire alphabet would have to happen. And I believe that prior experience negates the argument that if we regulated certain items to a greater extent that we completely lose our right to bear arms. It did not happen after the assault weapon ban. In fact the ban was eventually lifted.

 

Your point concerning Chicago is noted as their ban has not stopped violent crime, nor is it likely in the future to. The reality is that guns, like drugs are too prevalent and we can not undo hundreds of years of production. There is no system for removing any and all unregistered weapons so it's useless to attempt to restrict it.

[Langston Hughes]

And I guarentee you that not a single one of them would try this in The great state of Texas.

 

You mean like Charles Whitman, Larry Ashbroke or George Hannard the Luby's killer.

[napfirst]

That happened months ago. Are you sure you haven't slipped into a time warp?

I was muti-tasking at the time..caught the end of the report about the soda..I think it was refeering to someone or organization taking on the ban....but it doesn't change my point...

[FordBuyer]

I think it's very sad that every time we have one of these horrific mass shootings, it always turns into the same tiresome arguments about gun control measures. Every fricking time. For about a day it's about the poor victims, and then they are forgotten and another gun control debate. Let's just go back to the Old Wild West and shoot each other over losing a card game or a girl. We aren't that far from that as it is. In most American cities, hearing a gun shot is not much different than hearing a firecracker on 4th of July. Just another day in America with gunshot victims galore. No wonder SWAT teams storm houses today storm trooper style over relatively minor felonies as they know there is good chance owner or renter of dwelling is armed to the teeth with possible mental health problem from lost job, divorce, foreclosure, eviction notice, or whatever else.

[NickF1011]

I think it's very sad that every time we have one of these horrific mass shootings, it always turns into the same tiresome arguments about gun control measures. Every fricking time. For about a day it's about the poor victims, and then they are forgotten and another gun control debate. Let's just go back to the Old Wild West and shoot each other over losing a card game or a girl. We aren't that far from that as it is. In most American cities, hearing a gun shot is not much different than hearing a firecracker on 4th of July. Just another day in America with gunshot victims galore. No wonder SWAT teams storm houses today storm trooper style over relatively minor felonies as they know there is good chance owner or renter of dwelling is armed to the teeth with possible mental health problem from lost job, divorce, foreclosure, eviction notice, or whatever else.

 

You've lived near too Detroit too long.

[TomServo92]

 

 

You mean like Charles Whitman, Larry Ashbroke or George Hannard the Luby's killer.

 

Now go google up how many crimes were prevented in Texas (and other states with CCW laws) by citizens with concealed handguns. I suspect you'll find whole lot more than three.

Edited July 24, 2012 by TomServo92

[napfirst]

I think it's very sad that every time we have one of these horrific mass shootings, it always turns into the same tiresome arguments about gun control measures. Every fricking time. For about a day it's about the poor victims, and then they are forgotten and another gun control debate. Let's just go back to the Old Wild West and shoot each other over losing a card game or a girl. We aren't that far from that as it is. In most American cities, hearing a gun shot is not much different than hearing a firecracker on 4th of July. Just another day in America with gunshot victims galore. No wonder SWAT teams storm houses today storm trooper style over relatively minor felonies as they know there is good chance owner or renter of dwelling is armed to the teeth with possible mental health problem from lost job, divorce, foreclosure, eviction notice, or whatever else.

You summed it up pretty good.....especially in the black communities where our young men are killing each other in an alarming rate...but that goes back to breakup of the nuclear family......discussion for another time......

[sprinter]

I wondered how James Holmes could afford his arsenal within such a short period of time considering he was unemployed and collecting unemployment from the government. Usually those monies only cover a few basics a person needs to live on. Considering the cost of just one assault rifle between $1000 to $2000 depending upon the model, how did he do it? And then there is this student without any prior problems, extremely intelligent and does this abrupt flip-flop.

Well the news has a report today that James received a $26,000 stipend from the federal government. So either way the Feds paid for James' massacre.

 

"The swell of emotion comes as new information about the suspect emerges. 9 News has learned that James Holmes was awarded a prestigious grant from the National Institutes of Health. It gave the graduate student a $26,000 stipend and paid his tuition for the highly competitive program in neuroscience at the University of Colorado in Denver. "

http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/213977/158/James-Holmes-of-Aurora-Colorado-Received-26000-Stipend-Plus-Tuition-From-NIH

 

But the sudden flip-flop does peak my interest. Was our future 'brain doctor' exposed to an experiment that backfired? Most on here don't have a clue what our government does behind our backs. MK-ULTRA was real and experiments conducted by the CIA trying to produce the 'Manchurian Candidate'. http://science.discovery.com/stories/mkultra-02.html The program was reported to have ended back in the 1970's. But would the CIA really tell you the truth about their activities? Using the veil of national security, hell no. The CIA is always looking for the perfect assassin. Was James involved with something like this? We will never know for sure. But something doesn't smell right with this story.

[FordBuyer]

You've lived near too Detroit too long.

 

So how close are you to Baltimore, home of "Homicide, Life on the Streets?" Take your pick....Philadelphia, Chicago, Oakland, L.A., and on and on. Gunshot victims galore and morgues overfilling with corpses that met very unhappy endings. David Simon, former reporter for Baltimore Sun, could tell you a lot about life on the streets of Baltimore. Right up there with good old Detroit.

[FordBuyer]

You summed it up pretty good.....especially in the black communities where our young men are killing each other in an alarming rate...but that goes back to breakup of the nuclear family......discussion for another time......

 

Sad to say these horriifc crimes are happening more and more in middle class communities now. Around here, we have one horrific story a week. Business manager for Dearborn, MI schools is clubbed to death by his drugged out son. Granmother in wealthy West Bloomfield, Mi shoots her grandson dead as he begs for his life in 911 call. Young female in Allen Park, MI last week lets her former boyfriend stay with her because he is down on his luck, and when her fiance asks him to leave, he shoots them, dismembers the bodies, and throws the torsos and saw into Detroit River. Dang, this depravity goes on regularly now, and all murderers and victims here are white living in upscale neighborhoods. And the mass killings are usually white attackers.

[Versa-Tech]

 

 

You mean like Charles Whitman, Larry Ashbroke or George Hannard the Luby's killer.

I have no idea who those guys are.

[Versa-Tech]

Well the news has a report today that James received a $26,000 stipend from the federal government. So either way the Feds paid for James' massacre.

 

"The swell of emotion comes as new information about the suspect emerges. 9 News has learned that James Holmes was awarded a prestigious grant from the National Institutes of Health. It gave the graduate student a $26,000 stipend and paid his tuition for the highly competitive program in neuroscience at the University of Colorado in Denver. "

 

But the sudden flip-flop does peak my interest. Was our future 'brain doctor' exposed to an experiment that backfired? Most on here don't have a clue what our government does behind our backs. MK-ULTRA was real and experiments conducted by the CIA trying to produce the 'Manchurian Candidate'. http://science.discovery.com/stories/mkultra-02.html The program was reported to have ended back in the 1970's. But would the CIA really tell you the truth about their activities? Using the veil of national security, hell no. The CIA is always looking for the perfect assassin. Was James involved with something like this? We will never know for sure. But something doesn't smell right with this story.

[hysterical] Seriously? The media acts like this guy is some genius just because he graduated with top honors in neuroscience. All that tells me is that he had access to a lot of money and a shitload of aderol.

 

First off, his weapons were, by no means, tactical. This guys knowledge of combat was obviously limited to call of duty. His magazine wasn't even designed for semi auto fire, which is why it failed. This is basic training type of shit.

 

Second, his trip system for his bombs was terribly flawed. Any professional operative would have used glass break sensors to keep anyone from getting in through the window. They cost $20 at any security supply outlet.

 

Third, if he was a CIA knock, he would have been under strict survaillance. There's simply no way he could have acquired his weapons and supplies under such a watchful eye.

Edited July 24, 2012 by Versa-Tech

[cal50]

[hysterical]

 

Second, his trip system for his bombs was terribly flawed. Any professional operative would have used glass break sensors to keep anyone from getting in through the window. They cost $20 at any security supply outlet.

 

 

 

.....or a basic motion detector with a battery back up when the cops cut the power....

[napfirst]

An attept to politcize to shooting by msnbc host .........

 

Michael Eric Dyson, guest host on MSNBC's Ed Show: Do you think that there should be a push for tighter gun laws given the horror that you just endured and how it has impacted you personally? Do you feel compelled to push for tighter gun laws?

 

Jordan Ghawi, brother of victim Jessica Ghawi: Here's the thing, we can try to politicize this and make some sort of polarizing debate and make this a tenet of the election, but that's not what we're here to do right now. We're here to celebrate the lives of the victims that have been lost.

 

If somebody wants to do harm to somebody, they're going to find a way to do it. Whether it be with a weapon, such as a rifle or whether it be with any sort of means we should actually start to think about why people are doing this. And the reason why they're doing this is because they want their names out there.

[Versa-Tech]

 

 

 

.....or a basic motion detector with a battery back up when the cops cut the power....

Yeah, but better to just wire it with a spring loaded detonator so you can't cut the power, or boom. Either way, a glass break is cheaper and works with no external powersource. Edited July 25, 2012 by Versa-Tech

[goinbroke2]

An attept to politcize to shooting by msnbc host .........

 

Conspiracy time....

The guy, down on his luck is promised whatever by the gov to shoot a bunch of people and bring gun control to the forefront right when; 1) election coming (obama being against ownership) 2) Pelosi is pushing the un mandate of disarming the world with the exception of UN. Covered up well enough, this could work perfectly for obama and pelosi. Is there any transcripts of what obama said to the victim's families when he visited? Wonder if he promised anything? "I promise I'll get rid of guns so this will never happen again/nobody alse will suffer the pain your feeling today......if I'm reelected"

 

The reason I doubt this though, is because they would of had a perfectly orchastrated dump of anti-gun crap and that didn't happen. Within days the rhetoric would of been in full swing. OK, that and because it's a little far fetched. LOL

 

Of course they could be giving the time for the families to heal and then come out all at once a month or so later.....we'll see.....

[Langston Hughes]

Now go google up how many crimes were prevented in Texas (and other states with CCW laws) by citizens with concealed handguns. I suspect you'll find whole lot more than three.

 

Was I wrong that it has happened in Texas or not? I provided three names of mass shooters who all killed multiple people in Texas in what is a narrow discussion, whether of not it would happen in Texas. I don't believe I suggested that concealed carry doesn't stop crime, only that its erroneous to believe that it can't happen in states with less gun restrictions such as Texas.

 

The Luby's cafeteria killer held the grizzly distinction of most deaths during a mass shooting in modern times for almost 20 years.