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Guest Message by DevFuse

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Ford March 2012 Sales


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#21 OFFLINE   Biker16

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 10:49 AM

"Focus surge happened within the last two months for not inexplicable reasons (incentives, fleeting)."


Oh so what? Honda and Toyota are laying $ on Civic/Corolla hoods too, Ford can't sit still.
The days of "The ONLY good cars are T/H" and "Toyota never sells to fleets, never need incentives" blah, blah, blah are over. [Check what cars are for rent these days, not all Detroiters]

And a $2000 rebate on a $25K Titanium Focus [or $20k SE Sport] is not really 'giving cars away', there's more room to make $$.


I think ford needs to cool it on the incentives, they cannot produce enough cars to maintain that sales volume. over the next 6 months ford will be challenged to increase sales because of all the model changeover, and the addition of 3rd shifts at MAP and CAP.

because of the flexibility of MAP ford may need to add a 2nd production site for the Focus, I wonder how much it would cost to import from Europe vs the cost of establishing another production line and or running 3 shifts of overtime for extended periods of time.
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#22 OFFLINE   FordBuyer

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 10:53 AM

the competition in the B segment is much better than it was 1 year ago.
all new
sonic
rio
accent
yaris
versa.




see above:


And the Focus doesn't face tough competition in its segment also with new Dart showing up shortly. Every segment is super competitive, especially the popular high volume one's. We are three full months into 2012, and so far Fiesta sales are down over 20%. I'm sure Ford is looking at problem and knows that Fiestas are starting to clog up lots as new ones come in every day.
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#23 OFFLINE   FordBuyer

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 10:57 AM

I think ford needs to cool it on the incentives, they cannot produce enough cars to maintain that sales volume. over the next 6 months ford will be challenged to increase sales because of all the model changeover, and the addition of 3rd shifts at MAP and CAP.

because of the flexibility of MAP ford may need to add a 2nd production site for the Focus, I wonder how much it would cost to import from Europe vs the cost of establishing another production line and or running 3 shifts of overtime for extended periods of time.


Don't forget the plant shutdown in July for company wide vacation. Right now, MAP only makes about 5,000 Focus/week and can't sell 30,000/month more than one month every now and then if that. Fiesta needs to pick up some of the slack and should be selling better....like 7,000-10,000/month with record high gas spikes.
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#24 OFFLINE   ds91776

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 10:58 AM

Couldn't Ford add some extra Focus ( and possibly C-Max and a future Lincoln small car ) at the old Wayne Assembly Plant?

#25 OFFLINE   FordBuyer

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:01 AM

I think ford needs to cool it on the incentives, they cannot produce enough cars to maintain that sales volume. over the next 6 months ford will be challenged to increase sales because of all the model changeover, and the addition of 3rd shifts at MAP and CAP.

because of the flexibility of MAP ford may need to add a 2nd production site for the Focus, I wonder how much it would cost to import from Europe vs the cost of establishing another production line and or running 3 shifts of overtime for extended periods of time.


Ford has talked about importing the Focus wagon here from Europe, but haven't heard anymore for over a year. Importing about 20,000-30,000 Focus wagons/year would be great IMO. Europe certainly needs the work with Spain having over 20% unemployment rate and going up. Ford has big Focus plant in Valencia.
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#26 OFFLINE   FordBuyer

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:06 AM

Couldn't Ford add some extra Focus ( and possibly C-Max and a future Lincoln small car ) at the old Wayne Assembly Plant?


I believe much of Wayne is used for stamping. Don't forget, MAP is starting third shift which should add another 2,000 vehicles/week if needed. Hard to say if gas prices have topped out or not. Probably depends upon what Israel does with Iran nuclear facilities. I tend to believe that Israel will strike before year is out and all hell is going to break loose.
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#27 OFFLINE   RichardJensen

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:09 AM

You also have to remember that the Focus surge happened within the last two months for not inexplicable reasons (incentives, fleeting).

Prove the fleet volume.

The ONLY source you have for excessive fleet volume on the Focus was a poorly researched article that referred to THIRD QUARTER 2011 fleet volume.

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#28 OFFLINE   RichardJensen

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:13 AM

And, quite obviously, 28k Focus sales per month is unsustainable, and talking about adding a second plant for the Focus at this point is as premature as talking about adding a second plant for the Mustang in 2005.

photo-thumb-15254.jpg


#29 OFFLINE   NickF1011

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:23 AM

I fixed it for you.


Just because the B-segment is growing doesn't mean it's still not pretty tiny. Compared to just about every other segment, it's still very small.
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#30 OFFLINE   Kev-Mo

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:41 AM

Looking at the business news all around the web, I don't know if this is all that great. Apparently, of all the new car buyers in March, Ford and GM got the least % of them. Seems like Toyota is back, and could easily overtake Ford soon. Assuming that the new Fusion and Escape will take some time to catch on, and Ford will lose the current versions that are big sellers.

Edited by Kev-Mo, 03 April 2012 - 11:42 AM.


#31 OFFLINE   NickF1011

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:45 AM

Looking at the business news all around the web, I don't know if this is all that great. Apparently, of all the new car buyers in March, Ford and GM got the least % of them. Seems like Toyota is back, and could easily overtake Ford soon. Assuming that the new Fusion and Escape will take some time to catch on, and Ford will lose the current versions that are big sellers.


Oh no! Doom and gloom!

:runaway: :runaway:

:sos: :sos:

:drop: :drop:

Yes, the current Fusion and Escape are big sellers....with relatively big discounts. The new versions will almost undoubtedly be more profitable, even if they don't sell in quite as high bargain-level volumes. Sales crowns don't mean squat if you aren't making money getting there.

Edited by NickF1011, 03 April 2012 - 11:46 AM.

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#32 OFFLINE   Biker16

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:46 AM

Just because the B-segment is growing doesn't mean it's still not pretty tiny. Compared to just about every other segment, it's still very small.


it is larger than the D segment right now.

in order of volume rough guess of volume.
C/D ~3 million
C ~ 2.3 million
B .6 millon
D .5 million
E < .2 million

Being the 3rd highest selling car segment is something.

some B-car numbers form last month
nissan
juke 4165
versa 15,587

GM
Sonic 8251

hyndai
N/A

toyota
yaris 3547
IQ 1285
XD 1080
XB 2054

honda
N/A
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#33 OFFLINE   NickF1011

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 11:52 AM

it is larger than the D segment right now.

in order of volume rough guess of volume.
C/D ~3 million
C ~ 2.3 million
B .6 millon
D .5 million
E < .2 million

Being the 3rd highest selling car segment is something.

some B-car numbers form last month
nissan
juke 4165
versa 15,587

GM
Sonic 8251

hyndai
N/A

toyota
yaris 3547
IQ 1285
XD 1080
XB 2054

honda
N/A


And looking at those numbers, is 6500 units for the Fiesta something to sneeze at? Not at all. It could be a Scion. :hysterical:

And being the third of five CAR segments is one thing. Factor in trucks and its importance drops quite a bit. Remember that trucks have been more than half the market for new vehicles for some time now.
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#34 OFFLINE   Biker16

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:02 PM

And looking at those numbers, is 6500 units for the Fiesta something to sneeze at? Not at all. It could be a Scion. :hysterical:


understand that the Scion XD, XB and Yaris, are platform mates. and posibly built in the same factory on the same line as each other. also with the Scion and yaris they play an hi low game, where the Scion sell for much more than the Yaris does but in essence they are the same basic car under the skin. the global volume of the Yaris is quite large, BTW.

If the fiesta sold 6500 per month for the rest of the year it would easily break it own sales record.

the B=car market is very fragmented, with the Kia, soul, and Nissan juke to the blue light special Versa. the fiesta and fit are considered the higher tier of the segment, and the both are in need of upgrades to counter the increase in competition.

And being the third of five CAR segments is one thing. Factor in trucks and its importance drops quite a bit. Remember that trucks have been more than half the market for new vehicles for some time now.


Trucks have not been over 50% of the market for some time. today cars are the majority of vehicles sold.
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#35 OFFLINE   Deanh

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:05 PM

You also have to remember that the Focus surge happened within the last two months for not inexplicable reasons (incentives, fleeting).

Focus fleet sales are trivial, Fusion is the leader there...I called it, ford finally took notice of fledging focii sales and came out with competitive leases and incentives....
" Sizzler "...and 412hp is all you'll ever see from this engine.I'd rather have potential. The 5.0 is the very definition of being at death's door with no place to go. "Mettech"....Privately owned dealerships is so 19th Century.....Richard So, Dean, you gonna pull my words from your sig?. Sully (reg new Escape) Clearly, the Escape/Kuga/Vertrek/Fail will not sell in the same volume as the Escape does currently

#36 OFFLINE   FordBuyer

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:06 PM

Looking at the business news all around the web, I don't know if this is all that great. Apparently, of all the new car buyers in March, Ford and GM got the least % of them. Seems like Toyota is back, and could easily overtake Ford soon. Assuming that the new Fusion and Escape will take some time to catch on, and Ford will lose the current versions that are big sellers.


GM sales are rather disappointing because many sales analyts had GM much higher, but Chrysler beat estimates, and Ford cut back on fleet sales in March, and retail sales were up double digit. So there is always a story behind sales numbers. But I would agree the big story is Toyota back over 200,000 sales for month. First time since 2008. And to do that with that shitbox Corolla and super bland Camry plus poor seller Tundra. Don't forget Ford is a much smaller company and probably doesn't have the capacity to go much beyond 250,000 sales/month tops even if there were the customers. And Ford isn't building any new plant, but is spending a lot on Hermosillo, so maybe it can produce a few more vehicle plus get some extra capacity when Mazda leaves AAI.
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#37 OFFLINE   Havelock

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:06 PM

it is larger than the D segment right now.

in order of volume rough guess of volume.
C/D ~3 million
C ~ 2.3 million
B .6 millon
D .5 million
E < .2 million

Being the 3rd highest selling car segment is something.

some B-car numbers form last month
nissan
juke 4165
versa 15,587

GM
Sonic 8251

hyndai
N/A

toyota
yaris 3547
IQ 1285
XD 1080
XB 2054

honda
N/A

Your numbers are incorrect. Juke is a crossover, not a car. Versa should be grouped with comparably sized cars as it is larger than a focus based on passenger and cargo space...you know using industry standards. There maybe other issues but I think this sufficiently illustrates my point.
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#38 OFFLINE   Biker16

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:19 PM

Focus fleet sales are trivial, Fusion is the leader there...I called it, ford finally took notice of fledging focii sales and came out with competitive leases and incentives....


for good lease rates, you need to have good residuals, the Focus was too new to calculate residuals until recently.

Your numbers are incorrect. Juke is a crossover, not a car. Versa should be grouped with comparably sized cars as it is larger than a focus based on passenger and cargo space...you know using industry standards. There maybe other issues but I think this sufficiently illustrates my point.


this is murky area, you could also consider the XD and XB crossover too, this illustrates the segmentation of the that segment. people do cross shop the versa and fiesta more than the Versa and focus, despite it's size, people consider it to be a B -car, the new fusion, Accord, and Sonata are considered to be large cars by EPA standards, the 2000 focus hatch would also be considered a midsized car by EPA specs, but in all cases they were grouped with other cars in their class.

the fiesta hatch back with 85/15 or 100 Cu/Ft should be a Compact car but its not.

In closing, with the CUVs. MPVs, SUVs, XUVs and other TLAs it is mighty hard to categorize cars these days, please forgive me if my categories offended you.
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#39 OFFLINE   NickF1011

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:41 PM

understand that the Scion XD, XB and Yaris, are platform mates. and posibly built in the same factory on the same line as each other. also with the Scion and yaris they play an hi low game, where the Scion sell for much more than the Yaris does but in essence they are the same basic car under the skin. the global volume of the Yaris is quite large, BTW.

If the fiesta sold 6500 per month for the rest of the year it would easily break it own sales record.

the B=car market is very fragmented, with the Kia, soul, and Nissan juke to the blue light special Versa. the fiesta and fit are considered the higher tier of the segment, and the both are in need of upgrades to counter the increase in competition.



Trucks have not been over 50% of the market for some time. today cars are the majority of vehicles sold.


xD, xB, and Yaris combined still sell on about the same level as Fiesta by itself. :shrug:

And I'm pretty certain that trucks still account for over half the market. Remember -- that includes CUV's.
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#40 OFFLINE   Biker16

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 01:10 PM

xD, xB, and Yaris combined still sell on about the same level as Fiesta by itself. :shrug:

And I'm pretty certain that trucks still account for over half the market. Remember -- that includes CUV's.


no

http://online.wsj.co...-autosales.html

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