6 replies to this topic

[OldFordJim]

Don't know how many retirees are on here, but in light of the news last week about GM considering a plan to buy out current retirees pensions, I thought I'd ask how people feel about that. According to the news article, it could be either hourly, salary, or even both. The reason for it would be to lower GM's pension obligations with the pension fund currently being underfunded. And you know full well, that if GM does this, Ford would probably follow suit to keep GM from having too much of a competitive advantage. And the article also stated that GM and the UAW talked about that during contract talks and that there's a letter stating that this could happen in the future.

[fordd]

Don't know how many retirees are on here, but in light of the news last week about GM considering a plan to buy out current retirees pensions, I thought I'd ask how people feel about that. According to the news article, it could be either hourly, salary, or even both. The reason for it would be to lower GM's pension obligations with the pension fund currently being underfunded. And you know full well, that if GM does this, Ford would probably follow suit to keep GM from having too much of a competitive advantage. And the article also stated that GM and the UAW talked about that during contract talks and that there's a letter stating that this could happen in the future.

The article also said it would be voluntary. I am not retired but I do like this idea depending on what the dollar amount would be. Sign me up. I know of several retired people that worked in different industries that had their pension bought out and they made out like bandits.

[Furious1Auto]

Very clever, and with the number in my position that are only entitled to a partial pension, and have taken an early I forsee allot of takers. Esspecily those that have squandered their buyout, and need it to get buy. It's a no brained for the company, and the road to matching the transplants. It's also good for the union, because it lightens the number of retirees they represent. Would you also be signing off on your VEBA? The union could add an additional sum to clear them of their medical liabilities, and reducing the burden on the VEBA fund. Good show!

I missed the article, did they say what the payouts would be for signing off.
Some would likely settle for vehicle vouchers, or stock options. I am buying a new F-150 sometime this year.

Edited by Furious1Auto, 14 January 2012 - 07:43 PM.

[Furious1Auto]

Dammit I keep double posting, I got terrible internet. The ship WiFi sux.

Edited by Furious1Auto, 14 January 2012 - 11:26 AM.

[Pioneer]

http://www.detroitne...etiree-pensions

In the next couple of contract negotiations, look for the big 2 1/2 to buy out all defined pensions with lump sum payments to 401k's and yearly matching contributions.

[lovelincolns]

Don't know how many retirees are on here, but in light of the news last week about GM considering a plan to buy out current retirees pensions, I thought I'd ask how people feel about that. According to the news article, it could be either hourly, salary, or even both. The reason for it would be to lower GM's pension obligations with the pension fund currently being underfunded. And you know full well, that if GM does this, Ford would probably follow suit to keep GM from having too much of a competitive advantage. And the article also stated that GM and the UAW talked about that during contract talks and that there's a letter stating that this could happen in the future.

I would have to see the number but my initial reaction is no. I feel Ford is extremely solid and should stay that way. I have other market based investments and I kind of like the idea of the solid or at least as solid as possible pension money coming in from Ford regardless of market conditions. I have been retired for 31/2 years and it was very nice not to be overly concerned about my market based investments because I was getting that pension check every month. I would hate to be in a position where a big chunk of money I needed to live on was invested in a market that just lost 20%. I read too many horror stories about people who had their entire retirement tied up in market based 401k's that got hit really hard during this last recession and had to alter their plans because of it. I never did and it has affected how I think about this greatly. I also thought privatizing Social Security would be great but now I am leaning toward leaving it alone. SS was never meant to be a total retirement income but only part of a three legged stool comprised of SS, pension and savings. I think market fluctuations and the risks involved with them can be handled much easier if part of retirement income is secure (as much as possible). Given today's world conditions something can happen overnight that would greatly affect the world financial markets as we just experienced.

[Furious1Auto]

I understand what you are saying. However there is a huge advantage to a 401K or Roth IRA. Obviously a pension is better, and is paid for life. The advantage is that it is in the control of the individual recipient, and if the company goes belly up you lose nothing. While with a company controlled pension there is a huge risk. With the Steelworkers that had their pensions controlled by the company, when the companies filed bankruptcy, the bankruptcy court only forced them to pay 25 cents on the dollar to the vested recipients. That means if you were promised $2,000 a month, they only had to give you $500.

I always thought union controlled pensions were the best, and most solid. However as of Jan. 5th of this year MEBA froze all the pensions for their members, and are now providing what is called a defined contribution plan. (401K) In this case the pension plan was controlled by the union, and there was still a failure do to under funding.

You have to look at the big picture. If Ford was to file tomorrow you would lose 75 percent of what you receive now. They are doing very well now, but after the years of $6,000 profit sharing checks in 92' no one would have thought they would ever had uttered the words bankruptcy by 08'.

Wonder how many I-Reps will sell their pensions to buy Ford stock?

Edited by Furious1Auto, 14 January 2012 - 05:32 PM.