Edstock Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 However, I forget the publication, but Porsche Cayenne came out on top in extensive SUV comparison. For what they cost, the Cayenne should be #1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 With Lincoln sales so pitiful and going lower, now is the time to blow up the naming scheme with nothing really to lose. I like the way BMW does it because the numbers signify Litre displacement. The last letters Lincoln uses really don't mean anything. Most don't know Z stands for Zephyr which had such a short life a few years ago. There is more sales pain to the MKS name than the LS. The X in MK means nothing. The MKT and what T stands for is a fricking sales nightmare. Now a bigger problem...what to call an Escape Lincoln...MKE? Stupid. A Lincoln Explorer? Blow it up. A naming nightmare the way it now stands. As RJ said, BMW's numbers don't represent displacement. MKZ - Zephyr MKS - Sedan MKX - X-over MKT - Touring MKA - Aviator What does BMW3, 5, and 7 signify....doors? And M means high performance and much higher price. You're the one the used BMW as an example! Secondly, the X3 & X5 don't have those pseudo displacement numbers attached, and per convention the X6 should be a coupe and is in fact a 5 door hatchwagon. Actually, they do include them now (also on the Z4), but not in the same fashion as the sedans - it's now the X5 xdrive35i or xdrive50i for AWD, just 35i and 50i for non-AWD. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it: I think Dean was talking about the 5-series GT, no? Either way, I see quite a few X6s and some 5-series GTs running around down here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 As RJ said, BMW's numbers don't represent displacement. MKZ - Zephyr MKS - Sedan MKX - X-over MKT - Touring MKA - Aviator You're the one the used BMW as an example! Actually, they do include them now (also on the Z4), but not in the same fashion as the sedans - it's now the X5 xdrive35i or xdrive50i for AWD, just 35i and 50i for non-AWD. I think Dean was talking about the 5-series GT, no? Either way, I see quite a few X6s and some 5-series GTs running around down here. truthfully RMC, theyre both damn ugly...they are like vehicles that dont know what they are trying to be..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Short of Audi, I cannot stand German car interiors. They are stark, cold, have strange ergonomics, and it takes 15 functions to do what should only take 1-2. There is nothing warm or inviting about them at all. I don't want Lincoln to be a "copy me" luxury car. I want Lincoln to be Lincoln. To find their own niche, in the luxury car market. To produce something that someone can look at, and say, "there is an American luxury car." Anyone can "try" to be BMW or Mercedes. They will never out BMW or Mercedes, BMW or Mercedes. However, they can attain a similar prestige.................... based on their own merits. The truth being, if Ford came out with a "M3" clone, that was just as good as the M3, and cost the same as the M3, everyone here would bitch about how expensive it was. In other words, many here want a "M3" on a Buick budget. the ONLY German sports car I like is the Cayman...design just works for me, but I dislike the boxster.....weird... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 truthfully RMC, theyre both damn ugly...they are like vehicles that dont know what they are trying to be..... Agreed on the 5-GT (I like the 5 sedan), but something about me likes the X6, I don't know why. Impractical as hell (a 4-seat "utility" vehicle with the back lobbed off), I know, but still.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 the ONLY German sports car I like is the Cayman...design just works for me, but I dislike the boxster.....weird... The Cayman is my fave, too; there is a visual balance to it that the 911 and the Boxter do not have, IMHO. Getting Lincoln on par with BMW, etc. would happen a lot faster if they'd offer the MK Z with the SHO EB powertrain. It's all about perception, and when you perceive that your BMW is slow . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The Cayman is my fave, too; there is a visual balance to it that the 911 and the Boxter do not have, IMHO. Getting Lincoln on par with BMW, etc. would happen a lot faster if they'd offer the MK Z with the SHO EB powertrain. It's all about perception, and when you perceive that your BMW is slow . . . I know for a fact there is a mule.....whether we see it or not i dont know, however...it wouldnt surprize me when the next gen Fusion/ Mondeo rears its head..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 the ONLY German sports car I like is the Cayman...design just works for me, but I dislike the boxster.....weird... Ditto! I considered buying a used Cayman but will probably wait a few more years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'm all for power, but problem is the majority of BMWs out there are usually the cheaper mediocre models. Very rarely do I see the 335, its usually the 330 (or whatever other lower number this use this year)...Same with the 5-series. Its just the lease special so someone can say "I have a BMW" and once inside I notice they aren't any options in them. The rear BMW connosiuer will have the larger engine with some options, if they can afford it. Building the image of the brand up I believe will be the hardest task Lincoln will have to face, and thats my creating products people want. They might have to bite the bullet at first and offer "value" pricing, or longer warranty, throw in free maintenance, etc. When Lexus came in they built solid products, with good quiet interiors and a very low prices. I remember the LS started at $35K at that time. A decade ago when the Acura TL came in, it was always available fully loaded, at a great low price compared to it's competition. Lincoln might have to do something similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 truthfully RMC, theyre both damn ugly...they are like vehicles that dont know what they are trying to be..... Well thankfully the BMW pesuo CUV's are better looking then the Crosstour and whatever that Acura abortion is! I seriously wonder how the CUV sedan look is going to last...I'd almost include the current Taraus in that since it sits so high, but at least the greenhouse is sedan shaped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'm all for power, but problem is the majority of BMWs out there are usually the cheaper mediocre models. Very rarely do I see the 335, its usually the 330 (or whatever other lower number this use this year)...Same with the 5-series. Its just the lease special so someone can say "I have a BMW" and once inside I notice they aren't any options in them. The rear BMW connosiuer will have the larger engine with some options, if they can afford it. Building the image of the brand up I believe will be the hardest task Lincoln will have to face, and thats my creating products people want. They might have to bite the bullet at first and offer "value" pricing, or longer warranty, throw in free maintenance, etc. When Lexus came in they built solid products, with good quiet interiors and a very low prices. I remember the LS started at $35K at that time. A decade ago when the Acura TL came in, it was always available fully loaded, at a great low price compared to it's competition. Lincoln might have to do something similar. You hit an interesting point there regarding BMW. I looked at build and price a BMW for s*(t's and giggles. Options are single purchases for some little things I figure should be standard frankly. I understand nav and wheel and sport packages, no biggie. Then you price a standard 335i and it has nothing inside. I believe you if folks spend the dough just to say: "I got a BMW". Funny that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 You hit an interesting point there regarding BMW. I looked at build and price a BMW for s*(t's and giggles. Options are single purchases for some little things I figure should be standard frankly. I understand nav and wheel and sport packages, no biggie. Then you price a standard 335i and it has nothing inside. I believe you if folks spend the dough just to say: "I got a BMW". Funny that. Heck, most BMW's aren't even equipped with genuine leather as standard equipment. Even Lincoln does that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I know for a fact there is a mule.....whether we see it or not i dont know, however...it wouldnt surprize me when the next gen Fusion/ Mondeo rears its head..... Picture a car that has similar interior space to EB MKS but 400 lbs lighter and increased performance to boot.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Picture a car that has similar interior space to EB MKS but 400 lbs lighter and increased performance to boot.. ...as long as you can look past the 1990's Lumina profile. :poke: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) ...as long as you can look past the 1990's Lumina profile. :poke: I'm thinking more like XF Jaguar Coupe, replace DEW underpinnings with CD4, AWD and EB power train. Edited January 14, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'm thinking more like XF Jaguar Coupe, replace DEW underpinnings with CD4, AWD and EB power train. I LOVE the looks of the XF. I would buy a Lincoln version...if I had the $$$! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Will there be a Lincoln car that uses the 5.0 V-8? Or, as future Lincolns lose weight, will the 3.5EB be sufficient? For the 5.0 to be in a Lincoln, it seems like an Oz tie-in would be a good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Will there be a Lincoln car that uses the 5.0 V-8? Or, as future Lincolns lose weight, will the 3.5EB be sufficient? For the 5.0 to be in a Lincoln, it seems like an Oz tie-in would be a good idea. Probably not what you were thinking, but I'd guess the next Navigator will use the 5.0 and 6.2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I LOVE the looks of the XF. I would buy a Lincoln version...if I had the $$$! If there is a Lincoln version, just sell some of your Ford stock. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Heck, most BMW's aren't even equipped with genuine leather as standard equipment. Even Lincoln does that. I feel getting a BMW or VW for that matter, I'm not expecting the genuine leather because I think I'm also paying for the boat ride from Europe to here anyway. I think there's a reason BMW is seriously looking at production in the US for more of their vehicles. I sat in the back of a 3-series convertible a while back. The plastic mouldings are the same as in my Fiesta in the hard places. I think you're buying a name and BMW's are fine IMHO, they aren't all that unless you pony up for the good ones. Here, I feel Lincoln's got all the ingredients. If the argument for not getting a Lincoln is because the top-end Ford is just as tasty and filling, I take that as a compliment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Probably not what you were thinking, but I'd guess the next Navigator will use the 5.0 and 6.2. Reasonable guess. I hope the MKS MCE gets updated plants both in base and EB versions. The base I feel has been handicapped however, I met one MKS owner (not enough for a survey I admit) and the powerplant wasn't the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Probably not what you were thinking, but I'd guess the next Navigator will use the 5.0 and 6.2. you could count on EB V6 being in there too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue II Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 I'm thinking more like XF Jaguar Coupe, replace DEW underpinnings with CD4, AWD and EB power train. Golly Ge JP what a marvel idea. How did ya come up with that deduction? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 (edited) Golly Ge JP what a marvel idea. How did ya come up with that deduction? I can't say RWd because everyone will jump down my throat but switch it to something else and BINGO! In other news, Mays is reviewing progress on a couple of designs in February over on our side of the world but this is only a group meeting before final submission in September for something way in the future, so under One Ford it probably has nothing to do with this whatsoever... Mays has said that FNA, Cologne and Dunton are all working on submissions at the same time so it will be interesting to see what comes of all of this, whether it's all smoke and mirrors or is something quite remarkable happening behind the scenes... Edited January 15, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2b2 Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 ...In other news,Mays is reviewing progress on a couple of designs in February over on our side of the world... ....so it will be interesting to see what comes of all of this, whether it's all smoke and mirrors or is something quite remarkable happening behind the scenes... I hear Australia is a fairly dangerous place for noobs with lots of poisonous critters... ...maybe some Falcon lovers could offer J a tour of the outback? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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