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Spy Shots: 2007 Toyota Camry


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Link--Edmunds

 

Not much different than the current Lexus ES330. If Toyota thinks they're going to get new customers with this, they're nuts. :o

 

It looks kinda sloppy and melted. But like all Honda/Toyotas, the real appeal comes when you see them close up and notice the quality of the materials, build quality, paint finish...etc.. At least Toyota is adding some design flare to their cars.

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Looks to be a much better improvement over what is out now, commenting only on the exterior.

 

mazda-ish front fascia

Sonata/Accord-ish rear end

 

and looks to have a similar profile like a BMW if it carries the same profile that the Lexus did posted previously.

 

The interior, I think needed the most work...so we'll see how that looks first. Otherwise it looks like another solid entry from Toyota. :huh:

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So while this apparent Camery replacement looks like a Lexus, which may lead people who buy these cars think I got some bling bling Lexus for aToyota price. What happens to the average Lexus buyer who now thinks his car looks like a cheap knock off of a Toyota? Or does it really matter in the bottom range of the Lexus brand? Seems to me like a little bit of GM brand fuzzyness is sneaking in. If all Lexus's are so great why cannot they all have there own identity?

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Fusion kicks its ass!

 

The Camry will be a VERY good car. Toyota is reliably good about making high quality and class-leading products and the Fusion will be very old news by the time this one hits the streets. So I would be very hesitant to boast about the Fusion kicking Toyota's ass ;).

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So while this apparent Camery replacement looks like a Lexus, which may lead people who buy these cars think I got some bling bling Lexus for aToyota price. What happens to the average Lexus buyer who now thinks his car looks like a cheap knock off of a Toyota? Or does it really matter in the bottom range of the Lexus brand? Seems to me like a little bit of GM brand fuzzyness is sneaking in. If all Lexus's are so great why cannot they all have there own identity?

 

 

toyoyota and hondia always get a pass when they" badge engineer".

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I think for the first time in a long time Ford beat Toyota to the punch. The article says that the Camry is getting AWD in Japan. Wonder why not here.

 

The '07 Camry looks to offer nothing too compelling over the '06 Fusion. Maybe better fit and finish. Maybe. Toyota has done an abysmal job pushing the envelope in the states. They're taking this market largely for granted, and diverting resources into emerging market countries. Instead of doing real work to improve the Camry and Tundra, they've just pulled ahead the launch date of one, and moved production of the other to Texas. That's not "moving forward" that's treading water.

 

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The chance of fusion kicking anybodys ass is SLIM & NONE and it hurts me to say that!!!

 

Oh really? Then how come I have seen approximately 12 different Fusions driving around in my area in the last month or so?

 

I could care less about the Cramry... I wonder if their entire exhaust system is still designed quite shabbily; meaning that it hangs down kinda low and at risk if the car bottoms out!

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Oh really? Then how come I have seen approximately 12 different Fusions driving around in my area in the last month or so?

 

I could care less about the Cramry... I wonder if their entire exhaust system is still designed quite shabbily; meaning that it hangs down kinda low and at risk if the car bottoms out!

I wouldn't worry too much about what is driving around your area just check the final sales tally a year from now and see how bad fusion got it's a-- kicked by toyota and honda????

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I wouldn't worry too much about what is driving around your area just check the final sales tally a year from now and see how bad fusion got it's a-- kicked by toyota and honda????

Uh.

 

What?

 

Ford goes from like mayyyyyyybe 60-70k units of retail (with the Taurus) in the midsize sedan market to oh about 150k units with the Fusion, and you think Toyota is going to be celebrating?

 

Where do you think that volume (and the volume from the Sonata) is going to come from?

 

It's going to come from the biggest players in the market.

 

Unlike Toyota, Ford isn't subsidizing ambitious expansion plans with profits from increasingly undifferentiated models in this country.

 

Or, in case you haven't seen what happened to Sony in the 90s, the Japanese are not immune to arrogant miscalculations.

 

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Uh.

 

What?

 

Ford goes from like mayyyyyyybe 60-70k units of retail (with the Taurus) in the midsize sedan market to oh about 150k units with the Fusion, and you think Toyota is going to be celebrating?

 

Where do you think that volume (and the volume from the Sonata) is going to come from?

 

It's going to come from the biggest players in the market.

 

Unlike Toyota, Ford isn't subsidizing ambitious expansion plans with profits from increasingly undifferentiated models in this country.

 

Or, in case you haven't seen what happened to Sony in the 90s, the Japanese are not immune to arrogant miscalculations.

 

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Like I said just wait and see what the sales numbers are a year from now and I will bet the fusion isn't even close in sales or reliaibility to either toyota or honda???FYI: I am 61 yrs old and bought my first jap car 2 yrs ago after driving fords for around 40 plus yrs it is a camry and is hard to argue with at 30K has not been to the shop yet and I have been trying to break it just to see how tough it is. My 04 f-150 has had at least 4 trips to dealer for various issues and I am afraid if the big 3 don't get their quaility conrol together they are in for some rough times.

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looks like just about every other 4 door sedan out there to me.

 

styling is so 'equal' these days, the buying/reliability/service-warranty I kinda think will be the big selling points, hopefully the 500/fusion will have the reliability needed plus the warranty to back it up, but I really think the dealership experience(from what Ive read- never bought foreign) is better for some of the foreign makes. I really REALLY hope Ford finds a way to let us start ordering direct- yeah deliver it to whatever dealer for logistics, but let buyers 'buy it' themselves if they want.

I think to most people, the car dealer is right up there with the dentists chair on the 'least enjoyable experience' list. Sadly, Ive read quite often how nice it was dealing with import dealers compared to domestic. Ive only ever bought 4 NEW cars(1 chev/3 ford) but 3 out of the 4 sucked- the wifes windstar was smooth as silk, until it was time to service...3 times/3 strikes, theyre out too.

One other thing I really think would help Ford- would involve adding some people, but think it would be money well spent: a follow up call on EVERY dealer repair done under warranty- if theres some problems out there, smack the dealer a little if its legit:

 

the wifes windstar:

1) fuel pump @6000 miles

dealer towed in sunday- called wife to pick up 8 am monday? I call- they replaced a fuse. I ask them to let it idle 1/2 hour and call back- 10 minutes later he calls back"yeah, it blew three more...". Had she broke down on the way home with a 1 year old and a newborn I'd have flipped. To top it off a few months later her washer fluid light comes on, I go to fill it for her (ONLY dealer had EVER serviced this car) no cover on the fusebox- full of dead bugs, salt spray...still waiting for that to blow up. After bitching at the service guy, they give me a new fuse box cover, and assured me that they were just being nice as they KNEW they didnt leave it off or put it on wrong...

 

2) warranty repair- squeaky tierods, @20k miles

dropped off to get rid of squeak- asked them to go ahead and check brakes, reline if needed(one had a squeak that started a day before dropping off, so asked them to go ahead and look it over). Pick up car- pulling onto street steering wheel 45 degrees off- turn right around to see WTF...service guy says"oh yeah, the caster camber split is off we will need to drill out the spotwelds to relocate upper strut mount...". I say- 'not unless you wrecked it- it was fine yesterday'. he says' well nothing happened to it- heres the specs, it needs done...I go down the road to tireamerica to pay them the 69 bucks to realign- the guy checks it over, says its in spec, but towards one limit, but if anything this would cause pull in other direction- so he asks what I had them do- tierods/brakes(brakes cost 200 bucks for front pads/clean and inspect rear- more on that later), he says 'I bet they swapped the tires', explained how radials arent supposed to have roation reversed as plies settle from driving, said might even damage tires...called it 'ply steer' never heard of it before. he swaps tires, everythings fine. I go to pay(gladly- no drilling thru galvanized chassis on a salt exposed car), no charge- they rotate for free and check alignments for free...I about fall over, but leave one happy camper.

 

3) 1 week after tierods, leave on vacation- taking my 3 kids/wife/2 nephews for a couple day trip. on the highway about a half hour, some guy cuts in front of me, I hit the brakes and pedal goes almost to floor. pupm up, spongy, but ok, flashers on, get off at next exit...pop the hood, open the m/c and blow brakefluid all over the place? walk around the car and rear wheel is smoking like as if on fire. took bottled water from ice chest, soaked wheel- did you know a plastic hubcap can exceed 212 degrees??? Water actually boiled on the hubcap. after a few minutes steam bath, burnt fingers, get the drum off(yes 5 kids watching, in a parking lot with lots of expletives flying) to see one filthy mess of a rear brake with a stuck piston in the wheel cylinder...guess I found that squeek. guess 'clean and inspect' didnt cover removing the drum and cleaning/inspecting inside...was 4th of july, backed adjuster off limped to nearest dealer bought new wheel cylinder/wheel bearing/seals(grease was bubbling from dust cap), limped to autozone to get a drum, an hour later back on the road. that was and will be my last trip to that dealer for ANY kind of 'service'.

 

1 bad apple dont mean all are like that I know, but when crap like this goes on and theyve got the big 'ford' sign on the building, why should ford get a black eye for it? there really needs to be a real way to get service departments to 'put out or get out', but right now, who can you complain to? It would do Ford good to require a level of performance from all franchises, and a way to monitor it better.

 

when I bought my f150, that dealer(no longer in business) offered me a free oil change If I let them fill out my customer survey that would be coming in the mail- well I filled it out myself , along with a little letter to ford about their 'offer', and proudly changed my own oil. What do you want to bet though they had a LOT of 'perfect' reviews from other 'customers'.

 

I think most people have had the misfortune to run into a less than adequate service department at one time or another, and if so, its not fair to ford- these are individual businesses that they count on to ATTRACT buyers not scare them off...mistakes will happen but how mistakes are dealt with is what saves or loses a customer. The dealer experience can create or shred brand loyalty almost as much as the product.

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oops- double post and a half :)

 

I think a lot of people are giving too much weight to reliability as a factor as to why Americans don't buy American.

 

Nissan, Honda, Hyundai, BMW and Mercedes have all had serious quality problems that have been well publicized in the media. I believe people are aware that Jaguar has a high satisfaction survey result, yet their cars don't sell as well as hoped.

 

Simply put, most folks look for style, value, and a good dealership/service experience.

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Like I said just wait and see what the sales numbers are a year from now and I will bet the fusion isn't even close in sales or reliaibility to either toyota or honda???FYI: I am 61 yrs old and bought my first jap car 2 yrs ago after driving fords for around 40 plus yrs it is a camry and is hard to argue with at 30K has not been to the shop yet and I have been trying to break it just to see how tough it is. My 04 f-150 has had at least 4 trips to dealer for various issues and I am afraid if the big 3 don't get their quaility conrol together they are in for some rough times.

It will be impossible for the Fusion to come close to the Accord and/or Camry in sales numbers. Ford doesn't have the capacity to build 380k Fusions.

 

Furthermore, the idea that a car brand spankin' new on the market will sell 300k units+ is laughable.

 

Additionally, the most troublefree new fullsize is the Five Hundred, and the most troublefree new coupe is the Mustang.

 

BTW, an '04 Tundra would've been in the shop a few times by now, their brake rotors suck.

 

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It will be impossible for the Fusion to come close to the Accord and/or Camry in sales numbers. Ford doesn't have the capacity to build 380k Fusions.

 

Furthermore, the idea that a car brand spankin' new on the market will sell 300k units+ is laughable.

 

Additionally, the most troublefree new fullsize is the Five Hundred, and the most troublefree new coupe is the Mustang.

 

BTW, an '04 Tundra would've been in the shop a few times by now, their brake rotors suck.

 

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Rich: Don't get me wrong I'm not pushing jap vehicles I love the way my 04 drives, interior is great but it is so damn heavy the power is awful, the AC couldn't cool a bread box and all ford says is it is withing specs and the sicdes are so high I can't even set my lunch box in the bed and reach it but ford just can't seem to get it right and that is the reason they are losing so many buyers. Just venting I guess but next time will sure be looking around to see waht all is out there.

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Rich: Don't get me wrong I'm not pushing jap vehicles I love the way my 04 drives, interior is great but it is so damn heavy the power is awful, the AC couldn't cool a bread box and all ford says is it is withing specs and the sicdes are so high I can't even set my lunch box in the bed and reach it but ford just can't seem to get it right and that is the reason they are losing so many buyers. Just venting I guess but next time will sure be looking around to see waht all is out there.

Geez. I coulda swore this F150 was the most popular model ever. And that Ford's share of the fullsize truck market has been rock steady despite the introduction of the Titan and Tundra.

 

Trust me, the Tundra has terrrrrrible brakes. They will no doubt be better on the next model, but the next model will no doubt also have the steep sides that the F150 does. Monkey see, monkey do is the Toyota approach to trucks (not the Japanese approach, mind you--I'm not trying to feed cultural stereotypes here--but the Toyota approach).

 

Scuttlebutt has it that the '08 refresh of the F150 will include weight saving measures. As far as the lack of power, blame that on the too-tall first gear ratio. If you've got the 5.4L there's plenty of power on tap, it's just not geared to be felt in your backside. The standard F150 and Titan have similar final drive ratios (3.55 on the F150, 3.357 on the Titan); however, 1st gear on the F150 is 2.84:1 and 3.82:1 on the Titan. That's a big enough difference to make the F150 feel pretty weak off the line.

 

The Titan also has a 5 speed automatic while the F150 still makes do with a 4 speed auto. Likely the forthcoming 6-speed on the F150 will address some of the perceived lack of power.

 

Anyhoo, the Fusion is, in my mind, more competitive vis a vis the Camry than the Tundra is with the F150. How much of the gap Toyota closes with the next Tundra remains to be seen. However, I have my doubts about the desire of Toyota as a corporation; I have doubts about their will to succeed in this arena. Ford wants, no needs, to succeed in the midsize arena in order to survive. Toyota does not need the fullsize truck sales the way Ford needs the midsize sedan sales. I 'spect the next Tundra will be a creditable alternative to today's F150 in a few respects, but those advantages will be largely neutralized by improvements coming on the '08 F150.

 

Just my opinion.

 

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I see the next Tundra as a competitor to the Titan more so than the F150. The titan was a much better attempt than the tundra ever was, though I still see few and far between and still have never seen one on a construction site.

 

In the world of full size trucks that are actually used as trucks are meant its simply not worth it to jump ship if you havent had problems with what you have been buying. Its the same reason Ford will have a hard time getting midsize toyota/honda buyers to even step foot inside a fusion/500 no matter how good it is.

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